\\n\\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.\",\n \">\\n\\nhow?\",\n \">\\n\\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American\",\n \">\\n\\nwhite*\",\n \">\\n\\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.\",\n \">\\n\\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.\",\n \">\\n\\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.\",\n \">\\n\\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality\",\n \">\\n\\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?\",\n \">\\n\\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.\",\n \">\\n\\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.\",\n \">\\n\\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.\",\n \">\\n\\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \\\"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\\\" Or \\\"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\\\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.\",\n \">\\n\\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism\",\n \">\\n\\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol\",\n \">\\n\\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels\",\n \">\\n\\nthen explain\",\n \">\\n\\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.\",\n \">\\n\\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh\",\n \">\\n\\nfr\",\n \">\\n\\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture\",\n \">\\n\\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal\",\n \">\\n\\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity\",\n \">\\n\\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \\nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow\",\n \">\\n\\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \\nBut I do listen to music tho\",\n \">\\n\\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.\",\n \">\\n\\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?\",\n \">\\n\\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide\",\n \">\\n\\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?\",\n \">\\n\\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it\",\n \">\\n\\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.\",\n \">\\n\\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.\",\n \">\\n\\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value\",\n \">\\n\\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family\",\n \">\\n\\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \\\"other\\\" causes problems\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is exactly what op is doing\",\n \">\\n\\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more\",\n \">\\n\\nI'll agree with you until you get to \\\"black culture\\\".\\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \\\"black culture\\\" get a pass in this regards.\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.\",\n \">\\n\\n99% of the time white \\\"slaves\\\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \\\"nation\\\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.\",\n \">\\n\\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books\",\n \">\\n\\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?\",\n \">\\n\\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\\nbut it’s random asf.\\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult\",\n \">\\n\\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong\",\n \">\\n\\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \\nThey’d be too deep in the cult too\",\n \">\\n\\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for\",\n \">\\n\\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.\",\n \">\\n\\nYou can add religion to that.\",\n \">\\n\\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures\",\n \">\\n\\nI agree with you. It's cringe.\",\n \">\\n\\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?\",\n \">\\n\\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?\",\n \">\\n\\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring\",\n \">\\n\\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans\",\n \">\\n\\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \\\"black view or you want to be white so bad.\\\"\\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \\\"easy win\\\" in debates.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.\",\n \">\\n\\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead\",\n \">\\n\\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.\",\n \">\\n\\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.\",\n \">\\n\\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography\",\n \">\\n\\n\\\"Are the same people\\\" comments are always nonsense\",\n \">\\n\\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?\",\n \">\\n\\n\\\"Mexican, \\\"black\\\" and \\\"Asian\\\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.\",\n \">\\n\\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote\",\n \">\\n\\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.\",\n \">\\n\\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.\",\n \">\\n\\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \\nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \\n\\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \\n\\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \\nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol\",\n \">\\n\\nyou prolly would\",\n \">\\n\\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.\",\n \">\\n\\n\\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\\n\\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.\",\n \">\\n\\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above\",\n \">\\n\\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.\",\n \">\\n\\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.\",\n \">\\n\\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.\",\n \">\\n\\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.\",\n \">\\n\\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?\",\n \">\\n\\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?\",\n \">\\n\\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \\nCulture grounds us.\\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \\nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.\",\n \">\\n\\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today\",\n \">\\n\\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded\",\n \">\\n\\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.\",\n \">\\n\\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle\",\n \">\\n\\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.\",\n \">\\n\\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist\",\n \">\\n\\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \\nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.\",\n \">\\n\\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти\",\n \">\\n\\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.\",\n \">\\n\\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity\",\n \">\\n\\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?\",\n \">\\n\\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho\",\n \">\\n\\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.\",\n \">\\n\\nexactly\",\n \">\\n\\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \\nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.\",\n \">\\n\\n\\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\\n\\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.\",\n \">\\n\\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring\",\n \">\\n\\nFinally someone gets it\",\n \">\\n\\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from\",\n \">\\n\\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.\",\n \">\\n\\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back\",\n \">\\n\\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people\",\n \">\\n\\nThis.\",\n \">\\n\\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \\nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?\",\n \">\\n\\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?\",\n \">\\n\\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….\",\n \">\\n\\n\\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\\n\\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \\n\\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\\n\\nIdk why don't you ask them \\n\\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \\n\\nAnd? \\n\\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\\n\\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\\n\\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\\n\\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\\nShe's Muslim\",\n \">\\n\\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult\",\n \">\\n\\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\\nYup totally an unpopular opinion\",\n \">\\n\\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate\",\n \">\\n\\nGot any proof of that\\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \\\"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\\\". \\nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion\",\n \">\\n\\nIt brings a sense of community\",\n \">\\n\\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?\",\n \">\\n\\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \\nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \\nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.\",\n \">\\n\\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?\",\n \">\\n\\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅\",\n \">\\n\\nYou sound undercover prejudiced\",\n \">\\n\\nNot that deep undercover.\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \\\"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\\\" Or \\\"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\\\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.\",\n \">\\n\\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \\\"Irish\\\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.\",\n \">\\n\\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism\",\n \">\\n\\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol\",\n \">\\n\\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination\",\n \">\\n\\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.\",\n \">\\n\\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.\",\n \">\\n\\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \\nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.\",\n \">\\n\\nMexican\",\n \">\\n\\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \\nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.\",\n \">\\n\\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.\",\n \">\\n\\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them\",\n \">\\n\\nyea that’s basically my post\",\n \">\\n\\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...\",\n \">\\n\\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾\",\n \">\\n\\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \\\"it's a costume\\\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \\nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.\",\n \">\\n\\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.\",\n \">\\n\\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.\",\n \">\\n\\nhow?\",\n \">\\n\\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American\",\n \">\\n\\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \\\"others\\\".\",\n \">\\n\\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.\",\n \">\\n\\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality\",\n \">\\n\\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?\",\n \">\\n\\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.\",\n \">\\n\\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.\",\n \">\\n\\nyour point?\",\n \">\\n\\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.\",\n \">\\n\\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?\",\n \">\\n\\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \\nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \\npersonal identity. Same logic follows\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels\",\n \">\\n\\nthen explain\",\n \">\\n\\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.\",\n \">\\n\\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh\",\n \">\\n\\nPerson: •sneezes•\\nAmericans: that's racist\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?\",\n \">\\n\\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\\nbut it’s random asf.\\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult\",\n \">\\n\\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong\",\n \">\\n\\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \\nThey’d be too deep in the cult too\",\n \">\\n\\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture\",\n \">\\n\\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal\",\n \">\\n\\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity\",\n \">\\n\\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \\nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow\",\n \">\\n\\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \\nBut I do listen to music tho\",\n \">\\n\\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.\",\n \">\\n\\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value\",\n \">\\n\\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family\",\n \">\\n\\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \\\"other\\\" causes problems\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is exactly what op is doing\",\n \">\\n\\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more\"\n]"}}},{"rowIdx":239689,"cells":{"comment":{"kind":"string","value":">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?"},"context":{"kind":"list like","value":["Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",">\n\nyour point?",">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",">\n\nexactly",">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",">\n\nThis.",">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",">\n\nwelp you lost then",">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",">\n\nMexican",">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",">\n\nnever said that",">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",">\n\nhow?",">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",">\n\nwhite*",">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",">\n\nthen explain",">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",">\n\nfr",">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",">\n\nyou prolly would",">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",">\n\nexactly",">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",">\n\nFinally someone gets it",">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",">\n\nThis.",">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",">\n\nMexican",">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...",">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",">\n\nhow?",">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".",">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",">\n\nyour point?",">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",">\n\nthen explain",">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist",">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on."],"string":"[\n \"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\\n\\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.\",\n \">\\n\\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above\",\n \">\\n\\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.\",\n \">\\n\\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \\nCulture grounds us.\\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \\nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.\",\n \">\\n\\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today\",\n \">\\n\\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.\",\n \">\\n\\nyour point?\",\n \">\\n\\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.\",\n \">\\n\\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.\",\n \">\\n\\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?\",\n \">\\n\\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?\",\n \">\\n\\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?\",\n \">\\n\\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….\",\n \">\\n\\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded\",\n \">\\n\\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.\",\n \">\\n\\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \\nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.\",\n \">\\n\\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.\",\n \">\\n\\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle\",\n \">\\n\\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.\",\n \">\\n\\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist\",\n \">\\n\\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.\",\n \">\\n\\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity\",\n \">\\n\\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?\",\n \">\\n\\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho\",\n \">\\n\\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.\",\n \">\\n\\nexactly\",\n \">\\n\\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people\",\n \">\\n\\nThis.\",\n \">\\n\\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \\nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.\",\n \">\\n\\n\\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\\n\\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.\",\n \">\\n\\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from\",\n \">\\n\\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.\",\n \">\\n\\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.\",\n \">\\n\\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back\",\n \">\\n\\nIt brings a sense of community\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?\",\n \">\\n\\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?\",\n \">\\n\\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \\nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \\nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.\",\n \">\\n\\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾\",\n \">\\n\\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \\nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?\",\n \">\\n\\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.\",\n \">\\n\\n\\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\\n\\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \\n\\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\\n\\nIdk why don't you ask them \\n\\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \\n\\nAnd? \\n\\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\\n\\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\\n\\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\\n\\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\\nShe's Muslim\",\n \">\\n\\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult\",\n \">\\n\\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\\nYup totally an unpopular opinion\",\n \">\\n\\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate\",\n \">\\n\\nGot any proof of that\\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \\\"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\\\". \\nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion\",\n \">\\n\\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.\",\n \">\\n\\nwelp you lost then\",\n \">\\n\\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?\",\n \">\\n\\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅\",\n \">\\n\\nYou sound undercover prejudiced\",\n \">\\n\\nNot that deep undercover.\",\n \">\\n\\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.\",\n \">\\n\\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \\nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.\",\n \">\\n\\nMexican\",\n \">\\n\\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \\nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.\",\n \">\\n\\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.\",\n \">\\n\\n\\\"You believe what you know\\\"?\\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.\",\n \">\\n\\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them\",\n \">\\n\\nyea that’s basically my post\",\n \">\\n\\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\\n/S\",\n \">\\n\\nnever said that\",\n \">\\n\\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.\",\n \">\\n\\nI’m using culture and cult as different words\",\n \">\\n\\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.\",\n \">\\n\\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \\nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion\",\n \">\\n\\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?\",\n \">\\n\\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \\nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \\npersonal identity. Same logic follows\",\n \">\\n\\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \\\"it's a costume\\\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \\nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.\",\n \">\\n\\nhow?\",\n \">\\n\\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American\",\n \">\\n\\nwhite*\",\n \">\\n\\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.\",\n \">\\n\\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.\",\n \">\\n\\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.\",\n \">\\n\\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality\",\n \">\\n\\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?\",\n \">\\n\\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.\",\n \">\\n\\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.\",\n \">\\n\\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.\",\n \">\\n\\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \\\"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\\\" Or \\\"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\\\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.\",\n \">\\n\\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism\",\n \">\\n\\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol\",\n \">\\n\\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels\",\n \">\\n\\nthen explain\",\n \">\\n\\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.\",\n \">\\n\\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh\",\n \">\\n\\nfr\",\n \">\\n\\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture\",\n \">\\n\\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal\",\n \">\\n\\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity\",\n \">\\n\\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \\nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow\",\n \">\\n\\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \\nBut I do listen to music tho\",\n \">\\n\\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.\",\n \">\\n\\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?\",\n \">\\n\\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide\",\n \">\\n\\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?\",\n \">\\n\\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it\",\n \">\\n\\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.\",\n \">\\n\\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.\",\n \">\\n\\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value\",\n \">\\n\\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family\",\n \">\\n\\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \\\"other\\\" causes problems\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is exactly what op is doing\",\n \">\\n\\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more\",\n \">\\n\\nI'll agree with you until you get to \\\"black culture\\\".\\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \\\"black culture\\\" get a pass in this regards.\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.\",\n \">\\n\\n99% of the time white \\\"slaves\\\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \\\"nation\\\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.\",\n \">\\n\\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books\",\n \">\\n\\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?\",\n \">\\n\\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\\nbut it’s random asf.\\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult\",\n \">\\n\\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong\",\n \">\\n\\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \\nThey’d be too deep in the cult too\",\n \">\\n\\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for\",\n \">\\n\\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.\",\n \">\\n\\nYou can add religion to that.\",\n \">\\n\\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures\",\n \">\\n\\nI agree with you. It's cringe.\",\n \">\\n\\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?\",\n \">\\n\\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?\",\n \">\\n\\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring\",\n \">\\n\\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans\",\n \">\\n\\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \\\"black view or you want to be white so bad.\\\"\\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \\\"easy win\\\" in debates.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.\",\n \">\\n\\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead\",\n \">\\n\\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.\",\n \">\\n\\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.\",\n \">\\n\\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography\",\n \">\\n\\n\\\"Are the same people\\\" comments are always nonsense\",\n \">\\n\\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?\",\n \">\\n\\n\\\"Mexican, \\\"black\\\" and \\\"Asian\\\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.\",\n \">\\n\\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote\",\n \">\\n\\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.\",\n \">\\n\\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.\",\n \">\\n\\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \\nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \\n\\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \\n\\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \\nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol\",\n \">\\n\\nyou prolly would\",\n \">\\n\\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.\",\n \">\\n\\n\\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\\n\\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.\",\n \">\\n\\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above\",\n \">\\n\\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.\",\n \">\\n\\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.\",\n \">\\n\\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.\",\n \">\\n\\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.\",\n \">\\n\\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?\",\n \">\\n\\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?\",\n \">\\n\\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \\nCulture grounds us.\\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \\nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.\",\n \">\\n\\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today\",\n \">\\n\\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded\",\n \">\\n\\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.\",\n \">\\n\\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle\",\n \">\\n\\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.\",\n \">\\n\\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist\",\n \">\\n\\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \\nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.\",\n \">\\n\\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти\",\n \">\\n\\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.\",\n \">\\n\\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity\",\n \">\\n\\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?\",\n \">\\n\\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho\",\n \">\\n\\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.\",\n \">\\n\\nexactly\",\n \">\\n\\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \\nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.\",\n \">\\n\\n\\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\\n\\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.\",\n \">\\n\\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring\",\n \">\\n\\nFinally someone gets it\",\n \">\\n\\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from\",\n \">\\n\\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.\",\n \">\\n\\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back\",\n \">\\n\\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people\",\n \">\\n\\nThis.\",\n \">\\n\\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \\nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?\",\n \">\\n\\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?\",\n \">\\n\\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….\",\n \">\\n\\n\\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\\n\\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \\n\\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\\n\\nIdk why don't you ask them \\n\\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \\n\\nAnd? \\n\\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\\n\\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\\n\\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\\n\\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\\nShe's Muslim\",\n \">\\n\\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult\",\n \">\\n\\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\\nYup totally an unpopular opinion\",\n \">\\n\\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate\",\n \">\\n\\nGot any proof of that\\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \\\"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\\\". \\nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion\",\n \">\\n\\nIt brings a sense of community\",\n \">\\n\\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?\",\n \">\\n\\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \\nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \\nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.\",\n \">\\n\\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?\",\n \">\\n\\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅\",\n \">\\n\\nYou sound undercover prejudiced\",\n \">\\n\\nNot that deep undercover.\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \\\"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\\\" Or \\\"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\\\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.\",\n \">\\n\\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \\\"Irish\\\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.\",\n \">\\n\\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism\",\n \">\\n\\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol\",\n \">\\n\\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination\",\n \">\\n\\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.\",\n \">\\n\\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.\",\n \">\\n\\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \\nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.\",\n \">\\n\\nMexican\",\n \">\\n\\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \\nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.\",\n \">\\n\\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.\",\n \">\\n\\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them\",\n \">\\n\\nyea that’s basically my post\",\n \">\\n\\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...\",\n \">\\n\\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾\",\n \">\\n\\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \\\"it's a costume\\\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \\nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.\",\n \">\\n\\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.\",\n \">\\n\\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.\",\n \">\\n\\nhow?\",\n \">\\n\\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American\",\n \">\\n\\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \\\"others\\\".\",\n \">\\n\\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.\",\n \">\\n\\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality\",\n \">\\n\\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?\",\n \">\\n\\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.\",\n \">\\n\\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.\",\n \">\\n\\nyour point?\",\n \">\\n\\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.\",\n \">\\n\\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?\",\n \">\\n\\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \\nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \\npersonal identity. Same logic follows\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels\",\n \">\\n\\nthen explain\",\n \">\\n\\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.\",\n \">\\n\\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh\",\n \">\\n\\nPerson: •sneezes•\\nAmericans: that's racist\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?\",\n \">\\n\\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\\nbut it’s random asf.\\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult\",\n \">\\n\\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong\",\n \">\\n\\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \\nThey’d be too deep in the cult too\",\n \">\\n\\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture\",\n \">\\n\\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal\",\n \">\\n\\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity\",\n \">\\n\\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \\nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow\",\n \">\\n\\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \\nBut I do listen to music tho\",\n \">\\n\\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.\",\n \">\\n\\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value\",\n \">\\n\\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family\",\n \">\\n\\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \\\"other\\\" causes problems\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is exactly what op is doing\",\n \">\\n\\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more\",\n \">\\n\\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.\"\n]"}}},{"rowIdx":239690,"cells":{"comment":{"kind":"string","value":">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide"},"context":{"kind":"list like","value":["Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",">\n\nyour point?",">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",">\n\nexactly",">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",">\n\nThis.",">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",">\n\nwelp you lost then",">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",">\n\nMexican",">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",">\n\nnever said that",">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",">\n\nhow?",">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",">\n\nwhite*",">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",">\n\nthen explain",">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",">\n\nfr",">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",">\n\nyou prolly would",">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",">\n\nexactly",">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",">\n\nFinally someone gets it",">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",">\n\nThis.",">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",">\n\nMexican",">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...",">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",">\n\nhow?",">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".",">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",">\n\nyour point?",">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",">\n\nthen explain",">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist",">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?"],"string":"[\n \"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\\n\\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.\",\n \">\\n\\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above\",\n \">\\n\\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.\",\n \">\\n\\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \\nCulture grounds us.\\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \\nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.\",\n \">\\n\\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today\",\n \">\\n\\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.\",\n \">\\n\\nyour point?\",\n \">\\n\\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.\",\n \">\\n\\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.\",\n \">\\n\\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?\",\n \">\\n\\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?\",\n \">\\n\\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?\",\n \">\\n\\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….\",\n \">\\n\\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded\",\n \">\\n\\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.\",\n \">\\n\\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \\nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.\",\n \">\\n\\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.\",\n \">\\n\\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle\",\n \">\\n\\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.\",\n \">\\n\\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist\",\n \">\\n\\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.\",\n \">\\n\\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity\",\n \">\\n\\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?\",\n \">\\n\\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho\",\n \">\\n\\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.\",\n \">\\n\\nexactly\",\n \">\\n\\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people\",\n \">\\n\\nThis.\",\n \">\\n\\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \\nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.\",\n \">\\n\\n\\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\\n\\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.\",\n \">\\n\\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from\",\n \">\\n\\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.\",\n \">\\n\\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.\",\n \">\\n\\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back\",\n \">\\n\\nIt brings a sense of community\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?\",\n \">\\n\\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?\",\n \">\\n\\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \\nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \\nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.\",\n \">\\n\\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾\",\n \">\\n\\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \\nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?\",\n \">\\n\\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.\",\n \">\\n\\n\\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\\n\\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \\n\\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\\n\\nIdk why don't you ask them \\n\\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \\n\\nAnd? \\n\\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\\n\\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\\n\\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\\n\\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\\nShe's Muslim\",\n \">\\n\\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult\",\n \">\\n\\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\\nYup totally an unpopular opinion\",\n \">\\n\\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate\",\n \">\\n\\nGot any proof of that\\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \\\"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\\\". \\nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion\",\n \">\\n\\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.\",\n \">\\n\\nwelp you lost then\",\n \">\\n\\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?\",\n \">\\n\\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅\",\n \">\\n\\nYou sound undercover prejudiced\",\n \">\\n\\nNot that deep undercover.\",\n \">\\n\\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.\",\n \">\\n\\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \\nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.\",\n \">\\n\\nMexican\",\n \">\\n\\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \\nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.\",\n \">\\n\\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.\",\n \">\\n\\n\\\"You believe what you know\\\"?\\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.\",\n \">\\n\\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them\",\n \">\\n\\nyea that’s basically my post\",\n \">\\n\\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\\n/S\",\n \">\\n\\nnever said that\",\n \">\\n\\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.\",\n \">\\n\\nI’m using culture and cult as different words\",\n \">\\n\\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.\",\n \">\\n\\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \\nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion\",\n \">\\n\\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?\",\n \">\\n\\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \\nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \\npersonal identity. Same logic follows\",\n \">\\n\\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \\\"it's a costume\\\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \\nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.\",\n \">\\n\\nhow?\",\n \">\\n\\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American\",\n \">\\n\\nwhite*\",\n \">\\n\\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.\",\n \">\\n\\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.\",\n \">\\n\\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.\",\n \">\\n\\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality\",\n \">\\n\\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?\",\n \">\\n\\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.\",\n \">\\n\\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.\",\n \">\\n\\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.\",\n \">\\n\\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \\\"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\\\" Or \\\"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\\\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.\",\n \">\\n\\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism\",\n \">\\n\\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol\",\n \">\\n\\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels\",\n \">\\n\\nthen explain\",\n \">\\n\\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.\",\n \">\\n\\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh\",\n \">\\n\\nfr\",\n \">\\n\\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture\",\n \">\\n\\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal\",\n \">\\n\\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity\",\n \">\\n\\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \\nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow\",\n \">\\n\\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \\nBut I do listen to music tho\",\n \">\\n\\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.\",\n \">\\n\\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?\",\n \">\\n\\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide\",\n \">\\n\\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?\",\n \">\\n\\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it\",\n \">\\n\\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.\",\n \">\\n\\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.\",\n \">\\n\\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value\",\n \">\\n\\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family\",\n \">\\n\\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \\\"other\\\" causes problems\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is exactly what op is doing\",\n \">\\n\\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more\",\n \">\\n\\nI'll agree with you until you get to \\\"black culture\\\".\\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \\\"black culture\\\" get a pass in this regards.\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.\",\n \">\\n\\n99% of the time white \\\"slaves\\\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \\\"nation\\\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.\",\n \">\\n\\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books\",\n \">\\n\\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?\",\n \">\\n\\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\\nbut it’s random asf.\\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult\",\n \">\\n\\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong\",\n \">\\n\\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \\nThey’d be too deep in the cult too\",\n \">\\n\\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for\",\n \">\\n\\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.\",\n \">\\n\\nYou can add religion to that.\",\n \">\\n\\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures\",\n \">\\n\\nI agree with you. It's cringe.\",\n \">\\n\\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?\",\n \">\\n\\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?\",\n \">\\n\\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring\",\n \">\\n\\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans\",\n \">\\n\\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \\\"black view or you want to be white so bad.\\\"\\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \\\"easy win\\\" in debates.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.\",\n \">\\n\\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead\",\n \">\\n\\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.\",\n \">\\n\\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.\",\n \">\\n\\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography\",\n \">\\n\\n\\\"Are the same people\\\" comments are always nonsense\",\n \">\\n\\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?\",\n \">\\n\\n\\\"Mexican, \\\"black\\\" and \\\"Asian\\\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.\",\n \">\\n\\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote\",\n \">\\n\\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.\",\n \">\\n\\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.\",\n \">\\n\\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \\nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \\n\\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \\n\\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \\nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol\",\n \">\\n\\nyou prolly would\",\n \">\\n\\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.\",\n \">\\n\\n\\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\\n\\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.\",\n \">\\n\\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above\",\n \">\\n\\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.\",\n \">\\n\\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.\",\n \">\\n\\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.\",\n \">\\n\\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.\",\n \">\\n\\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?\",\n \">\\n\\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?\",\n \">\\n\\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \\nCulture grounds us.\\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \\nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.\",\n \">\\n\\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today\",\n \">\\n\\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded\",\n \">\\n\\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.\",\n \">\\n\\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle\",\n \">\\n\\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.\",\n \">\\n\\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist\",\n \">\\n\\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \\nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.\",\n \">\\n\\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти\",\n \">\\n\\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.\",\n \">\\n\\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity\",\n \">\\n\\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?\",\n \">\\n\\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho\",\n \">\\n\\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.\",\n \">\\n\\nexactly\",\n \">\\n\\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \\nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.\",\n \">\\n\\n\\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\\n\\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.\",\n \">\\n\\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring\",\n \">\\n\\nFinally someone gets it\",\n \">\\n\\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from\",\n \">\\n\\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.\",\n \">\\n\\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back\",\n \">\\n\\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people\",\n \">\\n\\nThis.\",\n \">\\n\\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \\nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?\",\n \">\\n\\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?\",\n \">\\n\\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….\",\n \">\\n\\n\\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\\n\\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \\n\\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\\n\\nIdk why don't you ask them \\n\\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \\n\\nAnd? \\n\\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\\n\\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\\n\\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\\n\\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\\nShe's Muslim\",\n \">\\n\\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult\",\n \">\\n\\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\\nYup totally an unpopular opinion\",\n \">\\n\\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate\",\n \">\\n\\nGot any proof of that\\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \\\"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\\\". \\nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion\",\n \">\\n\\nIt brings a sense of community\",\n \">\\n\\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?\",\n \">\\n\\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \\nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \\nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.\",\n \">\\n\\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?\",\n \">\\n\\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅\",\n \">\\n\\nYou sound undercover prejudiced\",\n \">\\n\\nNot that deep undercover.\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \\\"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\\\" Or \\\"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\\\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.\",\n \">\\n\\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \\\"Irish\\\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.\",\n \">\\n\\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism\",\n \">\\n\\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol\",\n \">\\n\\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination\",\n \">\\n\\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.\",\n \">\\n\\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.\",\n \">\\n\\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \\nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.\",\n \">\\n\\nMexican\",\n \">\\n\\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \\nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.\",\n \">\\n\\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.\",\n \">\\n\\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them\",\n \">\\n\\nyea that’s basically my post\",\n \">\\n\\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...\",\n \">\\n\\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾\",\n \">\\n\\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \\\"it's a costume\\\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \\nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.\",\n \">\\n\\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.\",\n \">\\n\\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.\",\n \">\\n\\nhow?\",\n \">\\n\\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American\",\n \">\\n\\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \\\"others\\\".\",\n \">\\n\\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.\",\n \">\\n\\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality\",\n \">\\n\\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?\",\n \">\\n\\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.\",\n \">\\n\\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.\",\n \">\\n\\nyour point?\",\n \">\\n\\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.\",\n \">\\n\\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?\",\n \">\\n\\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \\nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \\npersonal identity. Same logic follows\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels\",\n \">\\n\\nthen explain\",\n \">\\n\\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.\",\n \">\\n\\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh\",\n \">\\n\\nPerson: •sneezes•\\nAmericans: that's racist\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?\",\n \">\\n\\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\\nbut it’s random asf.\\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult\",\n \">\\n\\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong\",\n \">\\n\\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \\nThey’d be too deep in the cult too\",\n \">\\n\\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture\",\n \">\\n\\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal\",\n \">\\n\\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity\",\n \">\\n\\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \\nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow\",\n \">\\n\\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \\nBut I do listen to music tho\",\n \">\\n\\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.\",\n \">\\n\\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value\",\n \">\\n\\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family\",\n \">\\n\\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \\\"other\\\" causes problems\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is exactly what op is doing\",\n \">\\n\\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more\",\n \">\\n\\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.\",\n \">\\n\\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?\"\n]"}}},{"rowIdx":239691,"cells":{"comment":{"kind":"string","value":">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?"},"context":{"kind":"list like","value":["Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",">\n\nyour point?",">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",">\n\nexactly",">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",">\n\nThis.",">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",">\n\nwelp you lost then",">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",">\n\nMexican",">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",">\n\nnever said that",">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",">\n\nhow?",">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",">\n\nwhite*",">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",">\n\nthen explain",">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",">\n\nfr",">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",">\n\nyou prolly would",">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",">\n\nexactly",">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",">\n\nFinally someone gets it",">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",">\n\nThis.",">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",">\n\nMexican",">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...",">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",">\n\nhow?",">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".",">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",">\n\nyour point?",">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",">\n\nthen explain",">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist",">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide"],"string":"[\n \"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\\n\\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.\",\n \">\\n\\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above\",\n \">\\n\\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.\",\n \">\\n\\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \\nCulture grounds us.\\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \\nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.\",\n \">\\n\\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today\",\n \">\\n\\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.\",\n \">\\n\\nyour point?\",\n \">\\n\\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.\",\n \">\\n\\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.\",\n \">\\n\\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?\",\n \">\\n\\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?\",\n \">\\n\\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?\",\n \">\\n\\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….\",\n \">\\n\\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded\",\n \">\\n\\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.\",\n \">\\n\\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \\nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.\",\n \">\\n\\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.\",\n \">\\n\\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle\",\n \">\\n\\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.\",\n \">\\n\\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist\",\n \">\\n\\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.\",\n \">\\n\\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity\",\n \">\\n\\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?\",\n \">\\n\\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho\",\n \">\\n\\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.\",\n \">\\n\\nexactly\",\n \">\\n\\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people\",\n \">\\n\\nThis.\",\n \">\\n\\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \\nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.\",\n \">\\n\\n\\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\\n\\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.\",\n \">\\n\\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from\",\n \">\\n\\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.\",\n \">\\n\\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.\",\n \">\\n\\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back\",\n \">\\n\\nIt brings a sense of community\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?\",\n \">\\n\\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?\",\n \">\\n\\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \\nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \\nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.\",\n \">\\n\\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾\",\n \">\\n\\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \\nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?\",\n \">\\n\\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.\",\n \">\\n\\n\\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\\n\\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \\n\\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\\n\\nIdk why don't you ask them \\n\\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \\n\\nAnd? \\n\\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\\n\\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\\n\\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\\n\\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\\nShe's Muslim\",\n \">\\n\\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult\",\n \">\\n\\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\\nYup totally an unpopular opinion\",\n \">\\n\\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate\",\n \">\\n\\nGot any proof of that\\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \\\"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\\\". \\nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion\",\n \">\\n\\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.\",\n \">\\n\\nwelp you lost then\",\n \">\\n\\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?\",\n \">\\n\\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅\",\n \">\\n\\nYou sound undercover prejudiced\",\n \">\\n\\nNot that deep undercover.\",\n \">\\n\\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.\",\n \">\\n\\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \\nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.\",\n \">\\n\\nMexican\",\n \">\\n\\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \\nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.\",\n \">\\n\\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.\",\n \">\\n\\n\\\"You believe what you know\\\"?\\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.\",\n \">\\n\\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them\",\n \">\\n\\nyea that’s basically my post\",\n \">\\n\\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\\n/S\",\n \">\\n\\nnever said that\",\n \">\\n\\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.\",\n \">\\n\\nI’m using culture and cult as different words\",\n \">\\n\\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.\",\n \">\\n\\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \\nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion\",\n \">\\n\\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?\",\n \">\\n\\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \\nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \\npersonal identity. Same logic follows\",\n \">\\n\\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \\\"it's a costume\\\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \\nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.\",\n \">\\n\\nhow?\",\n \">\\n\\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American\",\n \">\\n\\nwhite*\",\n \">\\n\\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.\",\n \">\\n\\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.\",\n \">\\n\\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.\",\n \">\\n\\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality\",\n \">\\n\\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?\",\n \">\\n\\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.\",\n \">\\n\\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.\",\n \">\\n\\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.\",\n \">\\n\\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \\\"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\\\" Or \\\"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\\\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.\",\n \">\\n\\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism\",\n \">\\n\\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol\",\n \">\\n\\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels\",\n \">\\n\\nthen explain\",\n \">\\n\\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.\",\n \">\\n\\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh\",\n \">\\n\\nfr\",\n \">\\n\\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture\",\n \">\\n\\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal\",\n \">\\n\\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity\",\n \">\\n\\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \\nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow\",\n \">\\n\\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \\nBut I do listen to music tho\",\n \">\\n\\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.\",\n \">\\n\\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?\",\n \">\\n\\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide\",\n \">\\n\\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?\",\n \">\\n\\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it\",\n \">\\n\\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.\",\n \">\\n\\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.\",\n \">\\n\\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value\",\n \">\\n\\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family\",\n \">\\n\\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \\\"other\\\" causes problems\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is exactly what op is doing\",\n \">\\n\\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more\",\n \">\\n\\nI'll agree with you until you get to \\\"black culture\\\".\\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \\\"black culture\\\" get a pass in this regards.\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.\",\n \">\\n\\n99% of the time white \\\"slaves\\\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \\\"nation\\\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.\",\n \">\\n\\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books\",\n \">\\n\\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?\",\n \">\\n\\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\\nbut it’s random asf.\\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult\",\n \">\\n\\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong\",\n \">\\n\\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \\nThey’d be too deep in the cult too\",\n \">\\n\\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for\",\n \">\\n\\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.\",\n \">\\n\\nYou can add religion to that.\",\n \">\\n\\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures\",\n \">\\n\\nI agree with you. It's cringe.\",\n \">\\n\\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?\",\n \">\\n\\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?\",\n \">\\n\\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring\",\n \">\\n\\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans\",\n \">\\n\\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \\\"black view or you want to be white so bad.\\\"\\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \\\"easy win\\\" in debates.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.\",\n \">\\n\\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead\",\n \">\\n\\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.\",\n \">\\n\\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.\",\n \">\\n\\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography\",\n \">\\n\\n\\\"Are the same people\\\" comments are always nonsense\",\n \">\\n\\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?\",\n \">\\n\\n\\\"Mexican, \\\"black\\\" and \\\"Asian\\\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.\",\n \">\\n\\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote\",\n \">\\n\\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.\",\n \">\\n\\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.\",\n \">\\n\\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \\nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \\n\\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \\n\\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \\nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol\",\n \">\\n\\nyou prolly would\",\n \">\\n\\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.\",\n \">\\n\\n\\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\\n\\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.\",\n \">\\n\\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above\",\n \">\\n\\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.\",\n \">\\n\\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.\",\n \">\\n\\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.\",\n \">\\n\\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.\",\n \">\\n\\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?\",\n \">\\n\\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?\",\n \">\\n\\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \\nCulture grounds us.\\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \\nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.\",\n \">\\n\\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today\",\n \">\\n\\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded\",\n \">\\n\\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.\",\n \">\\n\\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle\",\n \">\\n\\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.\",\n \">\\n\\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist\",\n \">\\n\\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \\nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.\",\n \">\\n\\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти\",\n \">\\n\\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.\",\n \">\\n\\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity\",\n \">\\n\\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?\",\n \">\\n\\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho\",\n \">\\n\\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.\",\n \">\\n\\nexactly\",\n \">\\n\\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \\nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.\",\n \">\\n\\n\\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\\n\\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.\",\n \">\\n\\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring\",\n \">\\n\\nFinally someone gets it\",\n \">\\n\\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from\",\n \">\\n\\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.\",\n \">\\n\\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back\",\n \">\\n\\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people\",\n \">\\n\\nThis.\",\n \">\\n\\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \\nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?\",\n \">\\n\\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?\",\n \">\\n\\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….\",\n \">\\n\\n\\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\\n\\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \\n\\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\\n\\nIdk why don't you ask them \\n\\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \\n\\nAnd? \\n\\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\\n\\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\\n\\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\\n\\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\\nShe's Muslim\",\n \">\\n\\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult\",\n \">\\n\\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\\nYup totally an unpopular opinion\",\n \">\\n\\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate\",\n \">\\n\\nGot any proof of that\\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \\\"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\\\". \\nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion\",\n \">\\n\\nIt brings a sense of community\",\n \">\\n\\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?\",\n \">\\n\\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \\nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \\nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.\",\n \">\\n\\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?\",\n \">\\n\\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅\",\n \">\\n\\nYou sound undercover prejudiced\",\n \">\\n\\nNot that deep undercover.\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \\\"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\\\" Or \\\"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\\\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.\",\n \">\\n\\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \\\"Irish\\\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.\",\n \">\\n\\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism\",\n \">\\n\\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol\",\n \">\\n\\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination\",\n \">\\n\\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.\",\n \">\\n\\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.\",\n \">\\n\\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \\nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.\",\n \">\\n\\nMexican\",\n \">\\n\\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \\nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.\",\n \">\\n\\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.\",\n \">\\n\\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them\",\n \">\\n\\nyea that’s basically my post\",\n \">\\n\\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...\",\n \">\\n\\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾\",\n \">\\n\\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \\\"it's a costume\\\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \\nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.\",\n \">\\n\\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.\",\n \">\\n\\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.\",\n \">\\n\\nhow?\",\n \">\\n\\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American\",\n \">\\n\\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \\\"others\\\".\",\n \">\\n\\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.\",\n \">\\n\\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality\",\n \">\\n\\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?\",\n \">\\n\\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.\",\n \">\\n\\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.\",\n \">\\n\\nyour point?\",\n \">\\n\\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.\",\n \">\\n\\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?\",\n \">\\n\\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \\nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \\npersonal identity. Same logic follows\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels\",\n \">\\n\\nthen explain\",\n \">\\n\\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.\",\n \">\\n\\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh\",\n \">\\n\\nPerson: •sneezes•\\nAmericans: that's racist\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?\",\n \">\\n\\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\\nbut it’s random asf.\\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult\",\n \">\\n\\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong\",\n \">\\n\\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \\nThey’d be too deep in the cult too\",\n \">\\n\\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture\",\n \">\\n\\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal\",\n \">\\n\\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity\",\n \">\\n\\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \\nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow\",\n \">\\n\\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \\nBut I do listen to music tho\",\n \">\\n\\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.\",\n \">\\n\\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value\",\n \">\\n\\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family\",\n \">\\n\\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \\\"other\\\" causes problems\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is exactly what op is doing\",\n \">\\n\\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more\",\n \">\\n\\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.\",\n \">\\n\\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?\",\n \">\\n\\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide\"\n]"}}},{"rowIdx":239692,"cells":{"comment":{"kind":"string","value":">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it"},"context":{"kind":"list like","value":["Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",">\n\nyour point?",">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",">\n\nexactly",">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",">\n\nThis.",">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",">\n\nwelp you lost then",">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",">\n\nMexican",">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",">\n\nnever said that",">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",">\n\nhow?",">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",">\n\nwhite*",">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",">\n\nthen explain",">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",">\n\nfr",">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",">\n\nyou prolly would",">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",">\n\nexactly",">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",">\n\nFinally someone gets it",">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",">\n\nThis.",">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",">\n\nMexican",">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...",">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",">\n\nhow?",">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".",">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",">\n\nyour point?",">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",">\n\nthen explain",">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist",">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?"],"string":"[\n \"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\\n\\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.\",\n \">\\n\\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above\",\n \">\\n\\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.\",\n \">\\n\\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \\nCulture grounds us.\\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \\nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.\",\n \">\\n\\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today\",\n \">\\n\\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.\",\n \">\\n\\nyour point?\",\n \">\\n\\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.\",\n \">\\n\\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.\",\n \">\\n\\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?\",\n \">\\n\\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?\",\n \">\\n\\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?\",\n \">\\n\\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….\",\n \">\\n\\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded\",\n \">\\n\\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.\",\n \">\\n\\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \\nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.\",\n \">\\n\\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.\",\n \">\\n\\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle\",\n \">\\n\\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.\",\n \">\\n\\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist\",\n \">\\n\\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.\",\n \">\\n\\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity\",\n \">\\n\\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?\",\n \">\\n\\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho\",\n \">\\n\\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.\",\n \">\\n\\nexactly\",\n \">\\n\\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people\",\n \">\\n\\nThis.\",\n \">\\n\\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \\nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.\",\n \">\\n\\n\\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\\n\\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.\",\n \">\\n\\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from\",\n \">\\n\\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.\",\n \">\\n\\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.\",\n \">\\n\\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back\",\n \">\\n\\nIt brings a sense of community\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?\",\n \">\\n\\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?\",\n \">\\n\\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \\nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \\nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.\",\n \">\\n\\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾\",\n \">\\n\\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \\nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?\",\n \">\\n\\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.\",\n \">\\n\\n\\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\\n\\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \\n\\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\\n\\nIdk why don't you ask them \\n\\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \\n\\nAnd? \\n\\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\\n\\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\\n\\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\\n\\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\\nShe's Muslim\",\n \">\\n\\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult\",\n \">\\n\\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\\nYup totally an unpopular opinion\",\n \">\\n\\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate\",\n \">\\n\\nGot any proof of that\\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \\\"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\\\". \\nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion\",\n \">\\n\\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.\",\n \">\\n\\nwelp you lost then\",\n \">\\n\\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?\",\n \">\\n\\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅\",\n \">\\n\\nYou sound undercover prejudiced\",\n \">\\n\\nNot that deep undercover.\",\n \">\\n\\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.\",\n \">\\n\\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \\nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.\",\n \">\\n\\nMexican\",\n \">\\n\\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \\nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.\",\n \">\\n\\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.\",\n \">\\n\\n\\\"You believe what you know\\\"?\\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.\",\n \">\\n\\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them\",\n \">\\n\\nyea that’s basically my post\",\n \">\\n\\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\\n/S\",\n \">\\n\\nnever said that\",\n \">\\n\\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.\",\n \">\\n\\nI’m using culture and cult as different words\",\n \">\\n\\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.\",\n \">\\n\\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \\nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion\",\n \">\\n\\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?\",\n \">\\n\\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \\nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \\npersonal identity. Same logic follows\",\n \">\\n\\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \\\"it's a costume\\\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \\nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.\",\n \">\\n\\nhow?\",\n \">\\n\\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American\",\n \">\\n\\nwhite*\",\n \">\\n\\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.\",\n \">\\n\\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.\",\n \">\\n\\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.\",\n \">\\n\\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality\",\n \">\\n\\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?\",\n \">\\n\\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.\",\n \">\\n\\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.\",\n \">\\n\\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.\",\n \">\\n\\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \\\"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\\\" Or \\\"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\\\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.\",\n \">\\n\\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism\",\n \">\\n\\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol\",\n \">\\n\\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels\",\n \">\\n\\nthen explain\",\n \">\\n\\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.\",\n \">\\n\\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh\",\n \">\\n\\nfr\",\n \">\\n\\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture\",\n \">\\n\\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal\",\n \">\\n\\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity\",\n \">\\n\\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \\nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow\",\n \">\\n\\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \\nBut I do listen to music tho\",\n \">\\n\\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.\",\n \">\\n\\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?\",\n \">\\n\\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide\",\n \">\\n\\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?\",\n \">\\n\\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it\",\n \">\\n\\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.\",\n \">\\n\\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.\",\n \">\\n\\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value\",\n \">\\n\\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family\",\n \">\\n\\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \\\"other\\\" causes problems\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is exactly what op is doing\",\n \">\\n\\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more\",\n \">\\n\\nI'll agree with you until you get to \\\"black culture\\\".\\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \\\"black culture\\\" get a pass in this regards.\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.\",\n \">\\n\\n99% of the time white \\\"slaves\\\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \\\"nation\\\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.\",\n \">\\n\\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books\",\n \">\\n\\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?\",\n \">\\n\\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\\nbut it’s random asf.\\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult\",\n \">\\n\\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong\",\n \">\\n\\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \\nThey’d be too deep in the cult too\",\n \">\\n\\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for\",\n \">\\n\\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.\",\n \">\\n\\nYou can add religion to that.\",\n \">\\n\\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures\",\n \">\\n\\nI agree with you. It's cringe.\",\n \">\\n\\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?\",\n \">\\n\\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?\",\n \">\\n\\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring\",\n \">\\n\\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans\",\n \">\\n\\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \\\"black view or you want to be white so bad.\\\"\\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \\\"easy win\\\" in debates.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.\",\n \">\\n\\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead\",\n \">\\n\\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.\",\n \">\\n\\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.\",\n \">\\n\\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography\",\n \">\\n\\n\\\"Are the same people\\\" comments are always nonsense\",\n \">\\n\\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?\",\n \">\\n\\n\\\"Mexican, \\\"black\\\" and \\\"Asian\\\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.\",\n \">\\n\\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote\",\n \">\\n\\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.\",\n \">\\n\\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.\",\n \">\\n\\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \\nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \\n\\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \\n\\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \\nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol\",\n \">\\n\\nyou prolly would\",\n \">\\n\\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.\",\n \">\\n\\n\\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\\n\\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.\",\n \">\\n\\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above\",\n \">\\n\\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.\",\n \">\\n\\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.\",\n \">\\n\\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.\",\n \">\\n\\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.\",\n \">\\n\\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?\",\n \">\\n\\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?\",\n \">\\n\\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \\nCulture grounds us.\\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \\nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.\",\n \">\\n\\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today\",\n \">\\n\\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded\",\n \">\\n\\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.\",\n \">\\n\\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle\",\n \">\\n\\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.\",\n \">\\n\\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist\",\n \">\\n\\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \\nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.\",\n \">\\n\\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти\",\n \">\\n\\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.\",\n \">\\n\\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity\",\n \">\\n\\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?\",\n \">\\n\\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho\",\n \">\\n\\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.\",\n \">\\n\\nexactly\",\n \">\\n\\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \\nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.\",\n \">\\n\\n\\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\\n\\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.\",\n \">\\n\\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring\",\n \">\\n\\nFinally someone gets it\",\n \">\\n\\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from\",\n \">\\n\\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.\",\n \">\\n\\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back\",\n \">\\n\\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people\",\n \">\\n\\nThis.\",\n \">\\n\\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \\nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?\",\n \">\\n\\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?\",\n \">\\n\\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….\",\n \">\\n\\n\\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\\n\\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \\n\\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\\n\\nIdk why don't you ask them \\n\\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \\n\\nAnd? \\n\\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\\n\\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\\n\\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\\n\\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\\nShe's Muslim\",\n \">\\n\\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult\",\n \">\\n\\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\\nYup totally an unpopular opinion\",\n \">\\n\\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate\",\n \">\\n\\nGot any proof of that\\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \\\"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\\\". \\nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion\",\n \">\\n\\nIt brings a sense of community\",\n \">\\n\\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?\",\n \">\\n\\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \\nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \\nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.\",\n \">\\n\\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?\",\n \">\\n\\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅\",\n \">\\n\\nYou sound undercover prejudiced\",\n \">\\n\\nNot that deep undercover.\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \\\"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\\\" Or \\\"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\\\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.\",\n \">\\n\\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \\\"Irish\\\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.\",\n \">\\n\\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism\",\n \">\\n\\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol\",\n \">\\n\\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination\",\n \">\\n\\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.\",\n \">\\n\\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.\",\n \">\\n\\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \\nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.\",\n \">\\n\\nMexican\",\n \">\\n\\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \\nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.\",\n \">\\n\\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.\",\n \">\\n\\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them\",\n \">\\n\\nyea that’s basically my post\",\n \">\\n\\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...\",\n \">\\n\\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾\",\n \">\\n\\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \\\"it's a costume\\\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \\nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.\",\n \">\\n\\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.\",\n \">\\n\\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.\",\n \">\\n\\nhow?\",\n \">\\n\\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American\",\n \">\\n\\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \\\"others\\\".\",\n \">\\n\\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.\",\n \">\\n\\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality\",\n \">\\n\\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?\",\n \">\\n\\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.\",\n \">\\n\\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.\",\n \">\\n\\nyour point?\",\n \">\\n\\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.\",\n \">\\n\\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?\",\n \">\\n\\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \\nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \\npersonal identity. Same logic follows\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels\",\n \">\\n\\nthen explain\",\n \">\\n\\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.\",\n \">\\n\\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh\",\n \">\\n\\nPerson: •sneezes•\\nAmericans: that's racist\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?\",\n \">\\n\\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\\nbut it’s random asf.\\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult\",\n \">\\n\\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong\",\n \">\\n\\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \\nThey’d be too deep in the cult too\",\n \">\\n\\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture\",\n \">\\n\\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal\",\n \">\\n\\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity\",\n \">\\n\\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \\nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow\",\n \">\\n\\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \\nBut I do listen to music tho\",\n \">\\n\\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.\",\n \">\\n\\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value\",\n \">\\n\\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family\",\n \">\\n\\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \\\"other\\\" causes problems\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is exactly what op is doing\",\n \">\\n\\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more\",\n \">\\n\\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.\",\n \">\\n\\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?\",\n \">\\n\\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide\",\n \">\\n\\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?\"\n]"}}},{"rowIdx":239693,"cells":{"comment":{"kind":"string","value":">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them."},"context":{"kind":"list like","value":["Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",">\n\nyour point?",">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",">\n\nexactly",">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",">\n\nThis.",">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",">\n\nwelp you lost then",">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",">\n\nMexican",">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",">\n\nnever said that",">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",">\n\nhow?",">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",">\n\nwhite*",">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",">\n\nthen explain",">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",">\n\nfr",">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",">\n\nyou prolly would",">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",">\n\nexactly",">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",">\n\nFinally someone gets it",">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",">\n\nThis.",">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",">\n\nMexican",">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...",">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",">\n\nhow?",">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".",">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",">\n\nyour point?",">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",">\n\nthen explain",">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist",">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it"],"string":"[\n \"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\\n\\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.\",\n \">\\n\\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above\",\n \">\\n\\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.\",\n \">\\n\\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \\nCulture grounds us.\\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \\nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.\",\n \">\\n\\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today\",\n \">\\n\\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.\",\n \">\\n\\nyour point?\",\n \">\\n\\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.\",\n \">\\n\\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.\",\n \">\\n\\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?\",\n \">\\n\\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?\",\n \">\\n\\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?\",\n \">\\n\\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….\",\n \">\\n\\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded\",\n \">\\n\\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.\",\n \">\\n\\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \\nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.\",\n \">\\n\\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.\",\n \">\\n\\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle\",\n \">\\n\\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.\",\n \">\\n\\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist\",\n \">\\n\\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.\",\n \">\\n\\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity\",\n \">\\n\\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?\",\n \">\\n\\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho\",\n \">\\n\\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.\",\n \">\\n\\nexactly\",\n \">\\n\\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people\",\n \">\\n\\nThis.\",\n \">\\n\\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \\nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.\",\n \">\\n\\n\\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\\n\\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.\",\n \">\\n\\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from\",\n \">\\n\\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.\",\n \">\\n\\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.\",\n \">\\n\\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back\",\n \">\\n\\nIt brings a sense of community\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?\",\n \">\\n\\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?\",\n \">\\n\\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \\nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \\nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.\",\n \">\\n\\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾\",\n \">\\n\\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \\nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?\",\n \">\\n\\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.\",\n \">\\n\\n\\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\\n\\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \\n\\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\\n\\nIdk why don't you ask them \\n\\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \\n\\nAnd? \\n\\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\\n\\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\\n\\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\\n\\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\\nShe's Muslim\",\n \">\\n\\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult\",\n \">\\n\\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\\nYup totally an unpopular opinion\",\n \">\\n\\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate\",\n \">\\n\\nGot any proof of that\\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \\\"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\\\". \\nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion\",\n \">\\n\\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.\",\n \">\\n\\nwelp you lost then\",\n \">\\n\\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?\",\n \">\\n\\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅\",\n \">\\n\\nYou sound undercover prejudiced\",\n \">\\n\\nNot that deep undercover.\",\n \">\\n\\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.\",\n \">\\n\\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \\nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.\",\n \">\\n\\nMexican\",\n \">\\n\\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \\nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.\",\n \">\\n\\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.\",\n \">\\n\\n\\\"You believe what you know\\\"?\\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.\",\n \">\\n\\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them\",\n \">\\n\\nyea that’s basically my post\",\n \">\\n\\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\\n/S\",\n \">\\n\\nnever said that\",\n \">\\n\\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.\",\n \">\\n\\nI’m using culture and cult as different words\",\n \">\\n\\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.\",\n \">\\n\\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \\nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion\",\n \">\\n\\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?\",\n \">\\n\\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \\nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \\npersonal identity. Same logic follows\",\n \">\\n\\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \\\"it's a costume\\\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \\nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.\",\n \">\\n\\nhow?\",\n \">\\n\\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American\",\n \">\\n\\nwhite*\",\n \">\\n\\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.\",\n \">\\n\\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.\",\n \">\\n\\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.\",\n \">\\n\\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality\",\n \">\\n\\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?\",\n \">\\n\\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.\",\n \">\\n\\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.\",\n \">\\n\\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.\",\n \">\\n\\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \\\"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\\\" Or \\\"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\\\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.\",\n \">\\n\\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism\",\n \">\\n\\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol\",\n \">\\n\\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels\",\n \">\\n\\nthen explain\",\n \">\\n\\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.\",\n \">\\n\\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh\",\n \">\\n\\nfr\",\n \">\\n\\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture\",\n \">\\n\\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal\",\n \">\\n\\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity\",\n \">\\n\\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \\nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow\",\n \">\\n\\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \\nBut I do listen to music tho\",\n \">\\n\\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.\",\n \">\\n\\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?\",\n \">\\n\\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide\",\n \">\\n\\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?\",\n \">\\n\\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it\",\n \">\\n\\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.\",\n \">\\n\\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.\",\n \">\\n\\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value\",\n \">\\n\\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family\",\n \">\\n\\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \\\"other\\\" causes problems\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is exactly what op is doing\",\n \">\\n\\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more\",\n \">\\n\\nI'll agree with you until you get to \\\"black culture\\\".\\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \\\"black culture\\\" get a pass in this regards.\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.\",\n \">\\n\\n99% of the time white \\\"slaves\\\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \\\"nation\\\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.\",\n \">\\n\\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books\",\n \">\\n\\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?\",\n \">\\n\\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\\nbut it’s random asf.\\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult\",\n \">\\n\\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong\",\n \">\\n\\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \\nThey’d be too deep in the cult too\",\n \">\\n\\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for\",\n \">\\n\\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.\",\n \">\\n\\nYou can add religion to that.\",\n \">\\n\\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures\",\n \">\\n\\nI agree with you. It's cringe.\",\n \">\\n\\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?\",\n \">\\n\\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?\",\n \">\\n\\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring\",\n \">\\n\\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans\",\n \">\\n\\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \\\"black view or you want to be white so bad.\\\"\\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \\\"easy win\\\" in debates.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.\",\n \">\\n\\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead\",\n \">\\n\\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.\",\n \">\\n\\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.\",\n \">\\n\\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography\",\n \">\\n\\n\\\"Are the same people\\\" comments are always nonsense\",\n \">\\n\\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?\",\n \">\\n\\n\\\"Mexican, \\\"black\\\" and \\\"Asian\\\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.\",\n \">\\n\\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote\",\n \">\\n\\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.\",\n \">\\n\\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.\",\n \">\\n\\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \\nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \\n\\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \\n\\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \\nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol\",\n \">\\n\\nyou prolly would\",\n \">\\n\\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.\",\n \">\\n\\n\\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\\n\\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.\",\n \">\\n\\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above\",\n \">\\n\\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.\",\n \">\\n\\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.\",\n \">\\n\\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.\",\n \">\\n\\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.\",\n \">\\n\\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?\",\n \">\\n\\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?\",\n \">\\n\\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \\nCulture grounds us.\\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \\nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.\",\n \">\\n\\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today\",\n \">\\n\\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded\",\n \">\\n\\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.\",\n \">\\n\\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle\",\n \">\\n\\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.\",\n \">\\n\\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist\",\n \">\\n\\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \\nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.\",\n \">\\n\\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти\",\n \">\\n\\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.\",\n \">\\n\\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity\",\n \">\\n\\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?\",\n \">\\n\\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho\",\n \">\\n\\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.\",\n \">\\n\\nexactly\",\n \">\\n\\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \\nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.\",\n \">\\n\\n\\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\\n\\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.\",\n \">\\n\\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring\",\n \">\\n\\nFinally someone gets it\",\n \">\\n\\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from\",\n \">\\n\\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.\",\n \">\\n\\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back\",\n \">\\n\\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people\",\n \">\\n\\nThis.\",\n \">\\n\\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \\nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?\",\n \">\\n\\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?\",\n \">\\n\\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….\",\n \">\\n\\n\\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\\n\\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \\n\\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\\n\\nIdk why don't you ask them \\n\\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \\n\\nAnd? \\n\\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\\n\\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\\n\\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\\n\\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\\nShe's Muslim\",\n \">\\n\\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult\",\n \">\\n\\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\\nYup totally an unpopular opinion\",\n \">\\n\\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate\",\n \">\\n\\nGot any proof of that\\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \\\"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\\\". \\nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion\",\n \">\\n\\nIt brings a sense of community\",\n \">\\n\\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?\",\n \">\\n\\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \\nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \\nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.\",\n \">\\n\\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?\",\n \">\\n\\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅\",\n \">\\n\\nYou sound undercover prejudiced\",\n \">\\n\\nNot that deep undercover.\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \\\"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\\\" Or \\\"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\\\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.\",\n \">\\n\\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \\\"Irish\\\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.\",\n \">\\n\\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism\",\n \">\\n\\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol\",\n \">\\n\\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination\",\n \">\\n\\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.\",\n \">\\n\\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.\",\n \">\\n\\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \\nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.\",\n \">\\n\\nMexican\",\n \">\\n\\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \\nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.\",\n \">\\n\\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.\",\n \">\\n\\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them\",\n \">\\n\\nyea that’s basically my post\",\n \">\\n\\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...\",\n \">\\n\\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾\",\n \">\\n\\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \\\"it's a costume\\\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \\nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.\",\n \">\\n\\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.\",\n \">\\n\\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.\",\n \">\\n\\nhow?\",\n \">\\n\\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American\",\n \">\\n\\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \\\"others\\\".\",\n \">\\n\\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.\",\n \">\\n\\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality\",\n \">\\n\\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?\",\n \">\\n\\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.\",\n \">\\n\\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.\",\n \">\\n\\nyour point?\",\n \">\\n\\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.\",\n \">\\n\\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?\",\n \">\\n\\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \\nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \\npersonal identity. Same logic follows\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels\",\n \">\\n\\nthen explain\",\n \">\\n\\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.\",\n \">\\n\\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh\",\n \">\\n\\nPerson: •sneezes•\\nAmericans: that's racist\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?\",\n \">\\n\\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\\nbut it’s random asf.\\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult\",\n \">\\n\\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong\",\n \">\\n\\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \\nThey’d be too deep in the cult too\",\n \">\\n\\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture\",\n \">\\n\\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal\",\n \">\\n\\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity\",\n \">\\n\\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \\nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow\",\n \">\\n\\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \\nBut I do listen to music tho\",\n \">\\n\\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.\",\n \">\\n\\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value\",\n \">\\n\\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family\",\n \">\\n\\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \\\"other\\\" causes problems\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is exactly what op is doing\",\n \">\\n\\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more\",\n \">\\n\\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.\",\n \">\\n\\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?\",\n \">\\n\\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide\",\n \">\\n\\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?\",\n \">\\n\\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it\"\n]"}}},{"rowIdx":239694,"cells":{"comment":{"kind":"string","value":">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing."},"context":{"kind":"list like","value":["Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",">\n\nyour point?",">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",">\n\nexactly",">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",">\n\nThis.",">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",">\n\nwelp you lost then",">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",">\n\nMexican",">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",">\n\nnever said that",">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",">\n\nhow?",">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",">\n\nwhite*",">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",">\n\nthen explain",">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",">\n\nfr",">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",">\n\nyou prolly would",">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",">\n\nexactly",">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",">\n\nFinally someone gets it",">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",">\n\nThis.",">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",">\n\nMexican",">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...",">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",">\n\nhow?",">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".",">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",">\n\nyour point?",">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",">\n\nthen explain",">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist",">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them."],"string":"[\n \"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\\n\\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.\",\n \">\\n\\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above\",\n \">\\n\\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.\",\n \">\\n\\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \\nCulture grounds us.\\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \\nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.\",\n \">\\n\\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today\",\n \">\\n\\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.\",\n \">\\n\\nyour point?\",\n \">\\n\\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.\",\n \">\\n\\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.\",\n \">\\n\\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?\",\n \">\\n\\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?\",\n \">\\n\\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?\",\n \">\\n\\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….\",\n \">\\n\\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded\",\n \">\\n\\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.\",\n \">\\n\\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \\nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.\",\n \">\\n\\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.\",\n \">\\n\\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle\",\n \">\\n\\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.\",\n \">\\n\\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist\",\n \">\\n\\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.\",\n \">\\n\\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity\",\n \">\\n\\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?\",\n \">\\n\\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho\",\n \">\\n\\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.\",\n \">\\n\\nexactly\",\n \">\\n\\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people\",\n \">\\n\\nThis.\",\n \">\\n\\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \\nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.\",\n \">\\n\\n\\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\\n\\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.\",\n \">\\n\\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from\",\n \">\\n\\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.\",\n \">\\n\\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.\",\n \">\\n\\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back\",\n \">\\n\\nIt brings a sense of community\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?\",\n \">\\n\\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?\",\n \">\\n\\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \\nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \\nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.\",\n \">\\n\\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾\",\n \">\\n\\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \\nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?\",\n \">\\n\\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.\",\n \">\\n\\n\\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\\n\\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \\n\\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\\n\\nIdk why don't you ask them \\n\\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \\n\\nAnd? \\n\\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\\n\\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\\n\\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\\n\\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\\nShe's Muslim\",\n \">\\n\\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult\",\n \">\\n\\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\\nYup totally an unpopular opinion\",\n \">\\n\\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate\",\n \">\\n\\nGot any proof of that\\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \\\"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\\\". \\nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion\",\n \">\\n\\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.\",\n \">\\n\\nwelp you lost then\",\n \">\\n\\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?\",\n \">\\n\\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅\",\n \">\\n\\nYou sound undercover prejudiced\",\n \">\\n\\nNot that deep undercover.\",\n \">\\n\\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.\",\n \">\\n\\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \\nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.\",\n \">\\n\\nMexican\",\n \">\\n\\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \\nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.\",\n \">\\n\\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.\",\n \">\\n\\n\\\"You believe what you know\\\"?\\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.\",\n \">\\n\\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them\",\n \">\\n\\nyea that’s basically my post\",\n \">\\n\\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\\n/S\",\n \">\\n\\nnever said that\",\n \">\\n\\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.\",\n \">\\n\\nI’m using culture and cult as different words\",\n \">\\n\\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.\",\n \">\\n\\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \\nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion\",\n \">\\n\\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?\",\n \">\\n\\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \\nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \\npersonal identity. Same logic follows\",\n \">\\n\\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \\\"it's a costume\\\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \\nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.\",\n \">\\n\\nhow?\",\n \">\\n\\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American\",\n \">\\n\\nwhite*\",\n \">\\n\\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.\",\n \">\\n\\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.\",\n \">\\n\\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.\",\n \">\\n\\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality\",\n \">\\n\\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?\",\n \">\\n\\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.\",\n \">\\n\\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.\",\n \">\\n\\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.\",\n \">\\n\\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \\\"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\\\" Or \\\"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\\\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.\",\n \">\\n\\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism\",\n \">\\n\\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol\",\n \">\\n\\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels\",\n \">\\n\\nthen explain\",\n \">\\n\\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.\",\n \">\\n\\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh\",\n \">\\n\\nfr\",\n \">\\n\\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture\",\n \">\\n\\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal\",\n \">\\n\\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity\",\n \">\\n\\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \\nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow\",\n \">\\n\\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \\nBut I do listen to music tho\",\n \">\\n\\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.\",\n \">\\n\\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?\",\n \">\\n\\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide\",\n \">\\n\\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?\",\n \">\\n\\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it\",\n \">\\n\\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.\",\n \">\\n\\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.\",\n \">\\n\\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value\",\n \">\\n\\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family\",\n \">\\n\\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \\\"other\\\" causes problems\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is exactly what op is doing\",\n \">\\n\\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more\",\n \">\\n\\nI'll agree with you until you get to \\\"black culture\\\".\\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \\\"black culture\\\" get a pass in this regards.\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.\",\n \">\\n\\n99% of the time white \\\"slaves\\\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \\\"nation\\\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.\",\n \">\\n\\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books\",\n \">\\n\\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?\",\n \">\\n\\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\\nbut it’s random asf.\\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult\",\n \">\\n\\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong\",\n \">\\n\\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \\nThey’d be too deep in the cult too\",\n \">\\n\\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for\",\n \">\\n\\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.\",\n \">\\n\\nYou can add religion to that.\",\n \">\\n\\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures\",\n \">\\n\\nI agree with you. It's cringe.\",\n \">\\n\\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?\",\n \">\\n\\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?\",\n \">\\n\\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring\",\n \">\\n\\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans\",\n \">\\n\\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \\\"black view or you want to be white so bad.\\\"\\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \\\"easy win\\\" in debates.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.\",\n \">\\n\\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead\",\n \">\\n\\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.\",\n \">\\n\\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.\",\n \">\\n\\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography\",\n \">\\n\\n\\\"Are the same people\\\" comments are always nonsense\",\n \">\\n\\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?\",\n \">\\n\\n\\\"Mexican, \\\"black\\\" and \\\"Asian\\\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.\",\n \">\\n\\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote\",\n \">\\n\\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.\",\n \">\\n\\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.\",\n \">\\n\\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \\nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \\n\\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \\n\\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \\nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol\",\n \">\\n\\nyou prolly would\",\n \">\\n\\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.\",\n \">\\n\\n\\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\\n\\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.\",\n \">\\n\\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above\",\n \">\\n\\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.\",\n \">\\n\\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.\",\n \">\\n\\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.\",\n \">\\n\\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.\",\n \">\\n\\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?\",\n \">\\n\\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?\",\n \">\\n\\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \\nCulture grounds us.\\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \\nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.\",\n \">\\n\\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today\",\n \">\\n\\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded\",\n \">\\n\\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.\",\n \">\\n\\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle\",\n \">\\n\\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.\",\n \">\\n\\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist\",\n \">\\n\\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \\nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.\",\n \">\\n\\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти\",\n \">\\n\\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.\",\n \">\\n\\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity\",\n \">\\n\\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?\",\n \">\\n\\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho\",\n \">\\n\\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.\",\n \">\\n\\nexactly\",\n \">\\n\\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \\nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.\",\n \">\\n\\n\\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\\n\\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.\",\n \">\\n\\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring\",\n \">\\n\\nFinally someone gets it\",\n \">\\n\\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from\",\n \">\\n\\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.\",\n \">\\n\\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back\",\n \">\\n\\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people\",\n \">\\n\\nThis.\",\n \">\\n\\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \\nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?\",\n \">\\n\\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?\",\n \">\\n\\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….\",\n \">\\n\\n\\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\\n\\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \\n\\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\\n\\nIdk why don't you ask them \\n\\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \\n\\nAnd? \\n\\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\\n\\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\\n\\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\\n\\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\\nShe's Muslim\",\n \">\\n\\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult\",\n \">\\n\\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\\nYup totally an unpopular opinion\",\n \">\\n\\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate\",\n \">\\n\\nGot any proof of that\\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \\\"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\\\". \\nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion\",\n \">\\n\\nIt brings a sense of community\",\n \">\\n\\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?\",\n \">\\n\\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \\nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \\nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.\",\n \">\\n\\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?\",\n \">\\n\\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅\",\n \">\\n\\nYou sound undercover prejudiced\",\n \">\\n\\nNot that deep undercover.\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \\\"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\\\" Or \\\"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\\\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.\",\n \">\\n\\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \\\"Irish\\\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.\",\n \">\\n\\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism\",\n \">\\n\\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol\",\n \">\\n\\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination\",\n \">\\n\\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.\",\n \">\\n\\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.\",\n \">\\n\\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \\nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.\",\n \">\\n\\nMexican\",\n \">\\n\\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \\nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.\",\n \">\\n\\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.\",\n \">\\n\\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them\",\n \">\\n\\nyea that’s basically my post\",\n \">\\n\\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...\",\n \">\\n\\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾\",\n \">\\n\\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \\\"it's a costume\\\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \\nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.\",\n \">\\n\\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.\",\n \">\\n\\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.\",\n \">\\n\\nhow?\",\n \">\\n\\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American\",\n \">\\n\\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \\\"others\\\".\",\n \">\\n\\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.\",\n \">\\n\\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality\",\n \">\\n\\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?\",\n \">\\n\\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.\",\n \">\\n\\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.\",\n \">\\n\\nyour point?\",\n \">\\n\\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.\",\n \">\\n\\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?\",\n \">\\n\\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \\nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \\npersonal identity. Same logic follows\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels\",\n \">\\n\\nthen explain\",\n \">\\n\\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.\",\n \">\\n\\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh\",\n \">\\n\\nPerson: •sneezes•\\nAmericans: that's racist\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?\",\n \">\\n\\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\\nbut it’s random asf.\\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult\",\n \">\\n\\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong\",\n \">\\n\\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \\nThey’d be too deep in the cult too\",\n \">\\n\\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture\",\n \">\\n\\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal\",\n \">\\n\\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity\",\n \">\\n\\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \\nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow\",\n \">\\n\\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \\nBut I do listen to music tho\",\n \">\\n\\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.\",\n \">\\n\\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value\",\n \">\\n\\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family\",\n \">\\n\\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \\\"other\\\" causes problems\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is exactly what op is doing\",\n \">\\n\\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more\",\n \">\\n\\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.\",\n \">\\n\\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?\",\n \">\\n\\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide\",\n \">\\n\\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?\",\n \">\\n\\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it\",\n \">\\n\\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.\"\n]"}}},{"rowIdx":239695,"cells":{"comment":{"kind":"string","value":">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change."},"context":{"kind":"list like","value":["Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",">\n\nyour point?",">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",">\n\nexactly",">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",">\n\nThis.",">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",">\n\nwelp you lost then",">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",">\n\nMexican",">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",">\n\nnever said that",">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",">\n\nhow?",">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",">\n\nwhite*",">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",">\n\nthen explain",">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",">\n\nfr",">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",">\n\nyou prolly would",">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",">\n\nexactly",">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",">\n\nFinally someone gets it",">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",">\n\nThis.",">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",">\n\nMexican",">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...",">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",">\n\nhow?",">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".",">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",">\n\nyour point?",">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",">\n\nthen explain",">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist",">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing."],"string":"[\n \"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\\n\\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.\",\n \">\\n\\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above\",\n \">\\n\\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.\",\n \">\\n\\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \\nCulture grounds us.\\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \\nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.\",\n \">\\n\\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today\",\n \">\\n\\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.\",\n \">\\n\\nyour point?\",\n \">\\n\\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.\",\n \">\\n\\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.\",\n \">\\n\\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?\",\n \">\\n\\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?\",\n \">\\n\\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?\",\n \">\\n\\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….\",\n \">\\n\\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded\",\n \">\\n\\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.\",\n \">\\n\\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \\nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.\",\n \">\\n\\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.\",\n \">\\n\\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle\",\n \">\\n\\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.\",\n \">\\n\\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist\",\n \">\\n\\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.\",\n \">\\n\\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity\",\n \">\\n\\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?\",\n \">\\n\\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho\",\n \">\\n\\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.\",\n \">\\n\\nexactly\",\n \">\\n\\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people\",\n \">\\n\\nThis.\",\n \">\\n\\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \\nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.\",\n \">\\n\\n\\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\\n\\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.\",\n \">\\n\\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from\",\n \">\\n\\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.\",\n \">\\n\\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.\",\n \">\\n\\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back\",\n \">\\n\\nIt brings a sense of community\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?\",\n \">\\n\\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?\",\n \">\\n\\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \\nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \\nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.\",\n \">\\n\\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾\",\n \">\\n\\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \\nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?\",\n \">\\n\\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.\",\n \">\\n\\n\\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\\n\\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \\n\\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\\n\\nIdk why don't you ask them \\n\\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \\n\\nAnd? \\n\\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\\n\\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\\n\\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\\n\\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\\nShe's Muslim\",\n \">\\n\\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult\",\n \">\\n\\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\\nYup totally an unpopular opinion\",\n \">\\n\\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate\",\n \">\\n\\nGot any proof of that\\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \\\"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\\\". \\nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion\",\n \">\\n\\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.\",\n \">\\n\\nwelp you lost then\",\n \">\\n\\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?\",\n \">\\n\\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅\",\n \">\\n\\nYou sound undercover prejudiced\",\n \">\\n\\nNot that deep undercover.\",\n \">\\n\\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.\",\n \">\\n\\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \\nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.\",\n \">\\n\\nMexican\",\n \">\\n\\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \\nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.\",\n \">\\n\\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.\",\n \">\\n\\n\\\"You believe what you know\\\"?\\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.\",\n \">\\n\\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them\",\n \">\\n\\nyea that’s basically my post\",\n \">\\n\\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\\n/S\",\n \">\\n\\nnever said that\",\n \">\\n\\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.\",\n \">\\n\\nI’m using culture and cult as different words\",\n \">\\n\\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.\",\n \">\\n\\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \\nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion\",\n \">\\n\\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?\",\n \">\\n\\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \\nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \\npersonal identity. Same logic follows\",\n \">\\n\\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \\\"it's a costume\\\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \\nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.\",\n \">\\n\\nhow?\",\n \">\\n\\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American\",\n \">\\n\\nwhite*\",\n \">\\n\\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.\",\n \">\\n\\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.\",\n \">\\n\\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.\",\n \">\\n\\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality\",\n \">\\n\\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?\",\n \">\\n\\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.\",\n \">\\n\\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.\",\n \">\\n\\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.\",\n \">\\n\\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \\\"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\\\" Or \\\"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\\\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.\",\n \">\\n\\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism\",\n \">\\n\\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol\",\n \">\\n\\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels\",\n \">\\n\\nthen explain\",\n \">\\n\\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.\",\n \">\\n\\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh\",\n \">\\n\\nfr\",\n \">\\n\\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture\",\n \">\\n\\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal\",\n \">\\n\\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity\",\n \">\\n\\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \\nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow\",\n \">\\n\\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \\nBut I do listen to music tho\",\n \">\\n\\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.\",\n \">\\n\\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?\",\n \">\\n\\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide\",\n \">\\n\\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?\",\n \">\\n\\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it\",\n \">\\n\\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.\",\n \">\\n\\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.\",\n \">\\n\\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value\",\n \">\\n\\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family\",\n \">\\n\\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \\\"other\\\" causes problems\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is exactly what op is doing\",\n \">\\n\\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more\",\n \">\\n\\nI'll agree with you until you get to \\\"black culture\\\".\\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \\\"black culture\\\" get a pass in this regards.\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.\",\n \">\\n\\n99% of the time white \\\"slaves\\\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \\\"nation\\\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.\",\n \">\\n\\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books\",\n \">\\n\\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?\",\n \">\\n\\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\\nbut it’s random asf.\\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult\",\n \">\\n\\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong\",\n \">\\n\\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \\nThey’d be too deep in the cult too\",\n \">\\n\\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for\",\n \">\\n\\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.\",\n \">\\n\\nYou can add religion to that.\",\n \">\\n\\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures\",\n \">\\n\\nI agree with you. It's cringe.\",\n \">\\n\\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?\",\n \">\\n\\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?\",\n \">\\n\\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring\",\n \">\\n\\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans\",\n \">\\n\\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \\\"black view or you want to be white so bad.\\\"\\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \\\"easy win\\\" in debates.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.\",\n \">\\n\\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead\",\n \">\\n\\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.\",\n \">\\n\\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.\",\n \">\\n\\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography\",\n \">\\n\\n\\\"Are the same people\\\" comments are always nonsense\",\n \">\\n\\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?\",\n \">\\n\\n\\\"Mexican, \\\"black\\\" and \\\"Asian\\\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.\",\n \">\\n\\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote\",\n \">\\n\\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.\",\n \">\\n\\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.\",\n \">\\n\\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \\nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \\n\\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \\n\\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \\nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol\",\n \">\\n\\nyou prolly would\",\n \">\\n\\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.\",\n \">\\n\\n\\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\\n\\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.\",\n \">\\n\\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above\",\n \">\\n\\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.\",\n \">\\n\\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.\",\n \">\\n\\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.\",\n \">\\n\\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.\",\n \">\\n\\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?\",\n \">\\n\\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?\",\n \">\\n\\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \\nCulture grounds us.\\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \\nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.\",\n \">\\n\\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today\",\n \">\\n\\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded\",\n \">\\n\\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.\",\n \">\\n\\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle\",\n \">\\n\\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.\",\n \">\\n\\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist\",\n \">\\n\\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \\nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.\",\n \">\\n\\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти\",\n \">\\n\\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.\",\n \">\\n\\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity\",\n \">\\n\\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?\",\n \">\\n\\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho\",\n \">\\n\\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.\",\n \">\\n\\nexactly\",\n \">\\n\\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \\nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.\",\n \">\\n\\n\\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\\n\\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.\",\n \">\\n\\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring\",\n \">\\n\\nFinally someone gets it\",\n \">\\n\\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from\",\n \">\\n\\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.\",\n \">\\n\\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back\",\n \">\\n\\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people\",\n \">\\n\\nThis.\",\n \">\\n\\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \\nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?\",\n \">\\n\\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?\",\n \">\\n\\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….\",\n \">\\n\\n\\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\\n\\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \\n\\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\\n\\nIdk why don't you ask them \\n\\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \\n\\nAnd? \\n\\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\\n\\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\\n\\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\\n\\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\\nShe's Muslim\",\n \">\\n\\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult\",\n \">\\n\\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\\nYup totally an unpopular opinion\",\n \">\\n\\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate\",\n \">\\n\\nGot any proof of that\\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \\\"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\\\". \\nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion\",\n \">\\n\\nIt brings a sense of community\",\n \">\\n\\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?\",\n \">\\n\\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \\nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \\nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.\",\n \">\\n\\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?\",\n \">\\n\\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅\",\n \">\\n\\nYou sound undercover prejudiced\",\n \">\\n\\nNot that deep undercover.\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \\\"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\\\" Or \\\"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\\\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.\",\n \">\\n\\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \\\"Irish\\\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.\",\n \">\\n\\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism\",\n \">\\n\\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol\",\n \">\\n\\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination\",\n \">\\n\\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.\",\n \">\\n\\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.\",\n \">\\n\\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \\nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.\",\n \">\\n\\nMexican\",\n \">\\n\\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \\nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.\",\n \">\\n\\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.\",\n \">\\n\\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them\",\n \">\\n\\nyea that’s basically my post\",\n \">\\n\\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...\",\n \">\\n\\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾\",\n \">\\n\\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \\\"it's a costume\\\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \\nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.\",\n \">\\n\\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.\",\n \">\\n\\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.\",\n \">\\n\\nhow?\",\n \">\\n\\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American\",\n \">\\n\\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \\\"others\\\".\",\n \">\\n\\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.\",\n \">\\n\\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality\",\n \">\\n\\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?\",\n \">\\n\\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.\",\n \">\\n\\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.\",\n \">\\n\\nyour point?\",\n \">\\n\\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.\",\n \">\\n\\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?\",\n \">\\n\\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \\nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \\npersonal identity. Same logic follows\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels\",\n \">\\n\\nthen explain\",\n \">\\n\\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.\",\n \">\\n\\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh\",\n \">\\n\\nPerson: •sneezes•\\nAmericans: that's racist\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?\",\n \">\\n\\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\\nbut it’s random asf.\\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult\",\n \">\\n\\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong\",\n \">\\n\\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \\nThey’d be too deep in the cult too\",\n \">\\n\\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture\",\n \">\\n\\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal\",\n \">\\n\\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity\",\n \">\\n\\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \\nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow\",\n \">\\n\\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \\nBut I do listen to music tho\",\n \">\\n\\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.\",\n \">\\n\\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value\",\n \">\\n\\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family\",\n \">\\n\\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \\\"other\\\" causes problems\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is exactly what op is doing\",\n \">\\n\\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more\",\n \">\\n\\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.\",\n \">\\n\\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?\",\n \">\\n\\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide\",\n \">\\n\\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?\",\n \">\\n\\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it\",\n \">\\n\\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.\",\n \">\\n\\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.\"\n]"}}},{"rowIdx":239696,"cells":{"comment":{"kind":"string","value":">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise."},"context":{"kind":"list like","value":["Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",">\n\nyour point?",">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",">\n\nexactly",">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",">\n\nThis.",">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",">\n\nwelp you lost then",">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",">\n\nMexican",">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",">\n\nnever said that",">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",">\n\nhow?",">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",">\n\nwhite*",">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",">\n\nthen explain",">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",">\n\nfr",">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",">\n\nyou prolly would",">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",">\n\nexactly",">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",">\n\nFinally someone gets it",">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",">\n\nThis.",">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",">\n\nMexican",">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...",">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",">\n\nhow?",">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".",">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",">\n\nyour point?",">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",">\n\nthen explain",">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist",">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change."],"string":"[\n \"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\\n\\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.\",\n \">\\n\\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above\",\n \">\\n\\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.\",\n \">\\n\\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \\nCulture grounds us.\\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \\nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.\",\n \">\\n\\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today\",\n \">\\n\\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.\",\n \">\\n\\nyour point?\",\n \">\\n\\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.\",\n \">\\n\\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.\",\n \">\\n\\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?\",\n \">\\n\\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?\",\n \">\\n\\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?\",\n \">\\n\\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….\",\n \">\\n\\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded\",\n \">\\n\\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.\",\n \">\\n\\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \\nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.\",\n \">\\n\\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.\",\n \">\\n\\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle\",\n \">\\n\\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.\",\n \">\\n\\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist\",\n \">\\n\\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.\",\n \">\\n\\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity\",\n \">\\n\\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?\",\n \">\\n\\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho\",\n \">\\n\\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.\",\n \">\\n\\nexactly\",\n \">\\n\\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people\",\n \">\\n\\nThis.\",\n \">\\n\\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \\nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.\",\n \">\\n\\n\\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\\n\\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.\",\n \">\\n\\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from\",\n \">\\n\\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.\",\n \">\\n\\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.\",\n \">\\n\\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back\",\n \">\\n\\nIt brings a sense of community\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?\",\n \">\\n\\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?\",\n \">\\n\\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \\nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \\nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.\",\n \">\\n\\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾\",\n \">\\n\\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \\nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?\",\n \">\\n\\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.\",\n \">\\n\\n\\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\\n\\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \\n\\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\\n\\nIdk why don't you ask them \\n\\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \\n\\nAnd? \\n\\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\\n\\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\\n\\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\\n\\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\\nShe's Muslim\",\n \">\\n\\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult\",\n \">\\n\\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\\nYup totally an unpopular opinion\",\n \">\\n\\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate\",\n \">\\n\\nGot any proof of that\\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \\\"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\\\". \\nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion\",\n \">\\n\\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.\",\n \">\\n\\nwelp you lost then\",\n \">\\n\\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?\",\n \">\\n\\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅\",\n \">\\n\\nYou sound undercover prejudiced\",\n \">\\n\\nNot that deep undercover.\",\n \">\\n\\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.\",\n \">\\n\\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \\nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.\",\n \">\\n\\nMexican\",\n \">\\n\\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \\nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.\",\n \">\\n\\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.\",\n \">\\n\\n\\\"You believe what you know\\\"?\\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.\",\n \">\\n\\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them\",\n \">\\n\\nyea that’s basically my post\",\n \">\\n\\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\\n/S\",\n \">\\n\\nnever said that\",\n \">\\n\\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.\",\n \">\\n\\nI’m using culture and cult as different words\",\n \">\\n\\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.\",\n \">\\n\\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \\nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion\",\n \">\\n\\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?\",\n \">\\n\\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \\nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \\npersonal identity. Same logic follows\",\n \">\\n\\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \\\"it's a costume\\\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \\nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.\",\n \">\\n\\nhow?\",\n \">\\n\\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American\",\n \">\\n\\nwhite*\",\n \">\\n\\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.\",\n \">\\n\\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.\",\n \">\\n\\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.\",\n \">\\n\\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality\",\n \">\\n\\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?\",\n \">\\n\\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.\",\n \">\\n\\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.\",\n \">\\n\\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.\",\n \">\\n\\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \\\"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\\\" Or \\\"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\\\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.\",\n \">\\n\\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism\",\n \">\\n\\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol\",\n \">\\n\\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels\",\n \">\\n\\nthen explain\",\n \">\\n\\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.\",\n \">\\n\\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh\",\n \">\\n\\nfr\",\n \">\\n\\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture\",\n \">\\n\\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal\",\n \">\\n\\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity\",\n \">\\n\\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \\nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow\",\n \">\\n\\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \\nBut I do listen to music tho\",\n \">\\n\\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.\",\n \">\\n\\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?\",\n \">\\n\\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide\",\n \">\\n\\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?\",\n \">\\n\\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it\",\n \">\\n\\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.\",\n \">\\n\\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.\",\n \">\\n\\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value\",\n \">\\n\\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family\",\n \">\\n\\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \\\"other\\\" causes problems\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is exactly what op is doing\",\n \">\\n\\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more\",\n \">\\n\\nI'll agree with you until you get to \\\"black culture\\\".\\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \\\"black culture\\\" get a pass in this regards.\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.\",\n \">\\n\\n99% of the time white \\\"slaves\\\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \\\"nation\\\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.\",\n \">\\n\\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books\",\n \">\\n\\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?\",\n \">\\n\\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\\nbut it’s random asf.\\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult\",\n \">\\n\\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong\",\n \">\\n\\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \\nThey’d be too deep in the cult too\",\n \">\\n\\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for\",\n \">\\n\\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.\",\n \">\\n\\nYou can add religion to that.\",\n \">\\n\\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures\",\n \">\\n\\nI agree with you. It's cringe.\",\n \">\\n\\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?\",\n \">\\n\\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?\",\n \">\\n\\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring\",\n \">\\n\\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans\",\n \">\\n\\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \\\"black view or you want to be white so bad.\\\"\\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \\\"easy win\\\" in debates.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.\",\n \">\\n\\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead\",\n \">\\n\\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.\",\n \">\\n\\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.\",\n \">\\n\\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography\",\n \">\\n\\n\\\"Are the same people\\\" comments are always nonsense\",\n \">\\n\\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?\",\n \">\\n\\n\\\"Mexican, \\\"black\\\" and \\\"Asian\\\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.\",\n \">\\n\\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote\",\n \">\\n\\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.\",\n \">\\n\\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.\",\n \">\\n\\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \\nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \\n\\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \\n\\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \\nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol\",\n \">\\n\\nyou prolly would\",\n \">\\n\\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.\",\n \">\\n\\n\\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\\n\\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.\",\n \">\\n\\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above\",\n \">\\n\\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.\",\n \">\\n\\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.\",\n \">\\n\\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.\",\n \">\\n\\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.\",\n \">\\n\\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?\",\n \">\\n\\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?\",\n \">\\n\\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \\nCulture grounds us.\\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \\nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.\",\n \">\\n\\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today\",\n \">\\n\\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded\",\n \">\\n\\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.\",\n \">\\n\\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle\",\n \">\\n\\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.\",\n \">\\n\\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist\",\n \">\\n\\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \\nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.\",\n \">\\n\\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти\",\n \">\\n\\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.\",\n \">\\n\\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity\",\n \">\\n\\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?\",\n \">\\n\\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho\",\n \">\\n\\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.\",\n \">\\n\\nexactly\",\n \">\\n\\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \\nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.\",\n \">\\n\\n\\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\\n\\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.\",\n \">\\n\\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring\",\n \">\\n\\nFinally someone gets it\",\n \">\\n\\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from\",\n \">\\n\\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.\",\n \">\\n\\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back\",\n \">\\n\\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people\",\n \">\\n\\nThis.\",\n \">\\n\\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \\nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?\",\n \">\\n\\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?\",\n \">\\n\\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….\",\n \">\\n\\n\\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\\n\\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \\n\\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\\n\\nIdk why don't you ask them \\n\\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \\n\\nAnd? \\n\\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\\n\\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\\n\\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\\n\\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\\nShe's Muslim\",\n \">\\n\\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult\",\n \">\\n\\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\\nYup totally an unpopular opinion\",\n \">\\n\\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate\",\n \">\\n\\nGot any proof of that\\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \\\"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\\\". \\nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion\",\n \">\\n\\nIt brings a sense of community\",\n \">\\n\\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?\",\n \">\\n\\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \\nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \\nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.\",\n \">\\n\\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?\",\n \">\\n\\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅\",\n \">\\n\\nYou sound undercover prejudiced\",\n \">\\n\\nNot that deep undercover.\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \\\"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\\\" Or \\\"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\\\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.\",\n \">\\n\\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \\\"Irish\\\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.\",\n \">\\n\\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism\",\n \">\\n\\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol\",\n \">\\n\\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination\",\n \">\\n\\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.\",\n \">\\n\\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.\",\n \">\\n\\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \\nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.\",\n \">\\n\\nMexican\",\n \">\\n\\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \\nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.\",\n \">\\n\\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.\",\n \">\\n\\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them\",\n \">\\n\\nyea that’s basically my post\",\n \">\\n\\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...\",\n \">\\n\\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾\",\n \">\\n\\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \\\"it's a costume\\\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \\nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.\",\n \">\\n\\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.\",\n \">\\n\\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.\",\n \">\\n\\nhow?\",\n \">\\n\\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American\",\n \">\\n\\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \\\"others\\\".\",\n \">\\n\\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.\",\n \">\\n\\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality\",\n \">\\n\\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?\",\n \">\\n\\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.\",\n \">\\n\\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.\",\n \">\\n\\nyour point?\",\n \">\\n\\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.\",\n \">\\n\\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?\",\n \">\\n\\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \\nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \\npersonal identity. Same logic follows\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels\",\n \">\\n\\nthen explain\",\n \">\\n\\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.\",\n \">\\n\\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh\",\n \">\\n\\nPerson: •sneezes•\\nAmericans: that's racist\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?\",\n \">\\n\\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\\nbut it’s random asf.\\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult\",\n \">\\n\\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong\",\n \">\\n\\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \\nThey’d be too deep in the cult too\",\n \">\\n\\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture\",\n \">\\n\\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal\",\n \">\\n\\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity\",\n \">\\n\\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \\nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow\",\n \">\\n\\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \\nBut I do listen to music tho\",\n \">\\n\\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.\",\n \">\\n\\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value\",\n \">\\n\\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family\",\n \">\\n\\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \\\"other\\\" causes problems\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is exactly what op is doing\",\n \">\\n\\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more\",\n \">\\n\\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.\",\n \">\\n\\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?\",\n \">\\n\\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide\",\n \">\\n\\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?\",\n \">\\n\\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it\",\n \">\\n\\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.\",\n \">\\n\\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.\",\n \">\\n\\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.\"\n]"}}},{"rowIdx":239697,"cells":{"comment":{"kind":"string","value":">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy."},"context":{"kind":"list like","value":["Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",">\n\nyour point?",">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",">\n\nexactly",">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",">\n\nThis.",">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",">\n\nwelp you lost then",">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",">\n\nMexican",">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",">\n\nnever said that",">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",">\n\nhow?",">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",">\n\nwhite*",">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",">\n\nthen explain",">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",">\n\nfr",">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",">\n\nyou prolly would",">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",">\n\nexactly",">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",">\n\nFinally someone gets it",">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",">\n\nThis.",">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",">\n\nMexican",">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...",">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",">\n\nhow?",">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".",">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",">\n\nyour point?",">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",">\n\nthen explain",">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist",">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise."],"string":"[\n \"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\\n\\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.\",\n \">\\n\\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above\",\n \">\\n\\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.\",\n \">\\n\\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \\nCulture grounds us.\\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \\nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.\",\n \">\\n\\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today\",\n \">\\n\\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.\",\n \">\\n\\nyour point?\",\n \">\\n\\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.\",\n \">\\n\\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.\",\n \">\\n\\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?\",\n \">\\n\\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?\",\n \">\\n\\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?\",\n \">\\n\\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….\",\n \">\\n\\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded\",\n \">\\n\\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.\",\n \">\\n\\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \\nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.\",\n \">\\n\\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.\",\n \">\\n\\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle\",\n \">\\n\\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.\",\n \">\\n\\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist\",\n \">\\n\\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.\",\n \">\\n\\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity\",\n \">\\n\\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?\",\n \">\\n\\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho\",\n \">\\n\\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.\",\n \">\\n\\nexactly\",\n \">\\n\\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people\",\n \">\\n\\nThis.\",\n \">\\n\\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \\nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.\",\n \">\\n\\n\\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\\n\\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.\",\n \">\\n\\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from\",\n \">\\n\\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.\",\n \">\\n\\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.\",\n \">\\n\\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back\",\n \">\\n\\nIt brings a sense of community\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?\",\n \">\\n\\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?\",\n \">\\n\\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \\nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \\nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.\",\n \">\\n\\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾\",\n \">\\n\\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \\nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?\",\n \">\\n\\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.\",\n \">\\n\\n\\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\\n\\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \\n\\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\\n\\nIdk why don't you ask them \\n\\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \\n\\nAnd? \\n\\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\\n\\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\\n\\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\\n\\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\\nShe's Muslim\",\n \">\\n\\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult\",\n \">\\n\\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\\nYup totally an unpopular opinion\",\n \">\\n\\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate\",\n \">\\n\\nGot any proof of that\\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \\\"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\\\". \\nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion\",\n \">\\n\\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.\",\n \">\\n\\nwelp you lost then\",\n \">\\n\\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?\",\n \">\\n\\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅\",\n \">\\n\\nYou sound undercover prejudiced\",\n \">\\n\\nNot that deep undercover.\",\n \">\\n\\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.\",\n \">\\n\\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \\nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.\",\n \">\\n\\nMexican\",\n \">\\n\\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \\nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.\",\n \">\\n\\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.\",\n \">\\n\\n\\\"You believe what you know\\\"?\\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.\",\n \">\\n\\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them\",\n \">\\n\\nyea that’s basically my post\",\n \">\\n\\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\\n/S\",\n \">\\n\\nnever said that\",\n \">\\n\\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.\",\n \">\\n\\nI’m using culture and cult as different words\",\n \">\\n\\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.\",\n \">\\n\\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \\nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion\",\n \">\\n\\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?\",\n \">\\n\\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \\nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \\npersonal identity. Same logic follows\",\n \">\\n\\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \\\"it's a costume\\\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \\nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.\",\n \">\\n\\nhow?\",\n \">\\n\\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American\",\n \">\\n\\nwhite*\",\n \">\\n\\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.\",\n \">\\n\\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.\",\n \">\\n\\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.\",\n \">\\n\\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality\",\n \">\\n\\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?\",\n \">\\n\\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.\",\n \">\\n\\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.\",\n \">\\n\\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.\",\n \">\\n\\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \\\"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\\\" Or \\\"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\\\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.\",\n \">\\n\\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism\",\n \">\\n\\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol\",\n \">\\n\\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels\",\n \">\\n\\nthen explain\",\n \">\\n\\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.\",\n \">\\n\\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh\",\n \">\\n\\nfr\",\n \">\\n\\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture\",\n \">\\n\\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal\",\n \">\\n\\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity\",\n \">\\n\\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \\nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow\",\n \">\\n\\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \\nBut I do listen to music tho\",\n \">\\n\\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.\",\n \">\\n\\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?\",\n \">\\n\\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide\",\n \">\\n\\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?\",\n \">\\n\\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it\",\n \">\\n\\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.\",\n \">\\n\\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.\",\n \">\\n\\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value\",\n \">\\n\\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family\",\n \">\\n\\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \\\"other\\\" causes problems\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is exactly what op is doing\",\n \">\\n\\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more\",\n \">\\n\\nI'll agree with you until you get to \\\"black culture\\\".\\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \\\"black culture\\\" get a pass in this regards.\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.\",\n \">\\n\\n99% of the time white \\\"slaves\\\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \\\"nation\\\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.\",\n \">\\n\\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books\",\n \">\\n\\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?\",\n \">\\n\\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\\nbut it’s random asf.\\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult\",\n \">\\n\\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong\",\n \">\\n\\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \\nThey’d be too deep in the cult too\",\n \">\\n\\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for\",\n \">\\n\\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.\",\n \">\\n\\nYou can add religion to that.\",\n \">\\n\\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures\",\n \">\\n\\nI agree with you. It's cringe.\",\n \">\\n\\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?\",\n \">\\n\\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?\",\n \">\\n\\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring\",\n \">\\n\\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans\",\n \">\\n\\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \\\"black view or you want to be white so bad.\\\"\\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \\\"easy win\\\" in debates.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.\",\n \">\\n\\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead\",\n \">\\n\\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.\",\n \">\\n\\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.\",\n \">\\n\\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography\",\n \">\\n\\n\\\"Are the same people\\\" comments are always nonsense\",\n \">\\n\\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?\",\n \">\\n\\n\\\"Mexican, \\\"black\\\" and \\\"Asian\\\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.\",\n \">\\n\\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote\",\n \">\\n\\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.\",\n \">\\n\\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.\",\n \">\\n\\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \\nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \\n\\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \\n\\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \\nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol\",\n \">\\n\\nyou prolly would\",\n \">\\n\\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.\",\n \">\\n\\n\\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\\n\\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.\",\n \">\\n\\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above\",\n \">\\n\\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.\",\n \">\\n\\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.\",\n \">\\n\\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.\",\n \">\\n\\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.\",\n \">\\n\\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?\",\n \">\\n\\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?\",\n \">\\n\\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \\nCulture grounds us.\\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \\nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.\",\n \">\\n\\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today\",\n \">\\n\\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded\",\n \">\\n\\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.\",\n \">\\n\\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle\",\n \">\\n\\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.\",\n \">\\n\\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist\",\n \">\\n\\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \\nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.\",\n \">\\n\\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти\",\n \">\\n\\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.\",\n \">\\n\\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity\",\n \">\\n\\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?\",\n \">\\n\\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho\",\n \">\\n\\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.\",\n \">\\n\\nexactly\",\n \">\\n\\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \\nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.\",\n \">\\n\\n\\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\\n\\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.\",\n \">\\n\\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring\",\n \">\\n\\nFinally someone gets it\",\n \">\\n\\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from\",\n \">\\n\\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.\",\n \">\\n\\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back\",\n \">\\n\\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people\",\n \">\\n\\nThis.\",\n \">\\n\\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \\nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?\",\n \">\\n\\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?\",\n \">\\n\\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….\",\n \">\\n\\n\\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\\n\\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \\n\\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\\n\\nIdk why don't you ask them \\n\\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \\n\\nAnd? \\n\\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\\n\\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\\n\\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\\n\\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\\nShe's Muslim\",\n \">\\n\\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult\",\n \">\\n\\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\\nYup totally an unpopular opinion\",\n \">\\n\\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate\",\n \">\\n\\nGot any proof of that\\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \\\"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\\\". \\nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion\",\n \">\\n\\nIt brings a sense of community\",\n \">\\n\\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?\",\n \">\\n\\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \\nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \\nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.\",\n \">\\n\\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?\",\n \">\\n\\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅\",\n \">\\n\\nYou sound undercover prejudiced\",\n \">\\n\\nNot that deep undercover.\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \\\"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\\\" Or \\\"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\\\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.\",\n \">\\n\\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \\\"Irish\\\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.\",\n \">\\n\\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism\",\n \">\\n\\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol\",\n \">\\n\\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination\",\n \">\\n\\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.\",\n \">\\n\\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.\",\n \">\\n\\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \\nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.\",\n \">\\n\\nMexican\",\n \">\\n\\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \\nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.\",\n \">\\n\\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.\",\n \">\\n\\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them\",\n \">\\n\\nyea that’s basically my post\",\n \">\\n\\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...\",\n \">\\n\\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾\",\n \">\\n\\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \\\"it's a costume\\\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \\nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.\",\n \">\\n\\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.\",\n \">\\n\\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.\",\n \">\\n\\nhow?\",\n \">\\n\\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American\",\n \">\\n\\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \\\"others\\\".\",\n \">\\n\\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.\",\n \">\\n\\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality\",\n \">\\n\\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?\",\n \">\\n\\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.\",\n \">\\n\\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.\",\n \">\\n\\nyour point?\",\n \">\\n\\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.\",\n \">\\n\\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?\",\n \">\\n\\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \\nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \\npersonal identity. Same logic follows\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels\",\n \">\\n\\nthen explain\",\n \">\\n\\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.\",\n \">\\n\\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh\",\n \">\\n\\nPerson: •sneezes•\\nAmericans: that's racist\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?\",\n \">\\n\\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\\nbut it’s random asf.\\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult\",\n \">\\n\\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong\",\n \">\\n\\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \\nThey’d be too deep in the cult too\",\n \">\\n\\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture\",\n \">\\n\\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal\",\n \">\\n\\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity\",\n \">\\n\\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \\nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow\",\n \">\\n\\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \\nBut I do listen to music tho\",\n \">\\n\\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.\",\n \">\\n\\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value\",\n \">\\n\\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family\",\n \">\\n\\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \\\"other\\\" causes problems\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is exactly what op is doing\",\n \">\\n\\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more\",\n \">\\n\\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.\",\n \">\\n\\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?\",\n \">\\n\\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide\",\n \">\\n\\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?\",\n \">\\n\\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it\",\n \">\\n\\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.\",\n \">\\n\\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.\",\n \">\\n\\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.\",\n \">\\n\\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.\"\n]"}}},{"rowIdx":239698,"cells":{"comment":{"kind":"string","value":">\n\nwelp you lost then"},"context":{"kind":"list like","value":["Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",">\n\nyour point?",">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",">\n\nexactly",">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",">\n\nThis.",">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",">\n\nwelp you lost then",">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",">\n\nMexican",">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",">\n\nnever said that",">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",">\n\nhow?",">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",">\n\nwhite*",">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",">\n\nthen explain",">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",">\n\nfr",">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",">\n\nyou prolly would",">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",">\n\nexactly",">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",">\n\nFinally someone gets it",">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",">\n\nThis.",">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",">\n\nMexican",">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...",">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",">\n\nhow?",">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".",">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",">\n\nyour point?",">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",">\n\nthen explain",">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist",">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy."],"string":"[\n \"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\\n\\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.\",\n \">\\n\\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above\",\n \">\\n\\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.\",\n \">\\n\\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \\nCulture grounds us.\\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \\nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.\",\n \">\\n\\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today\",\n \">\\n\\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.\",\n \">\\n\\nyour point?\",\n \">\\n\\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.\",\n \">\\n\\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.\",\n \">\\n\\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?\",\n \">\\n\\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?\",\n \">\\n\\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?\",\n \">\\n\\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….\",\n \">\\n\\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded\",\n \">\\n\\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.\",\n \">\\n\\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \\nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.\",\n \">\\n\\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.\",\n \">\\n\\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle\",\n \">\\n\\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.\",\n \">\\n\\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist\",\n \">\\n\\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.\",\n \">\\n\\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity\",\n \">\\n\\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?\",\n \">\\n\\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho\",\n \">\\n\\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.\",\n \">\\n\\nexactly\",\n \">\\n\\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people\",\n \">\\n\\nThis.\",\n \">\\n\\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \\nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.\",\n \">\\n\\n\\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\\n\\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.\",\n \">\\n\\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from\",\n \">\\n\\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.\",\n \">\\n\\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.\",\n \">\\n\\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back\",\n \">\\n\\nIt brings a sense of community\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?\",\n \">\\n\\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?\",\n \">\\n\\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \\nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \\nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.\",\n \">\\n\\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾\",\n \">\\n\\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \\nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?\",\n \">\\n\\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.\",\n \">\\n\\n\\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\\n\\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \\n\\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\\n\\nIdk why don't you ask them \\n\\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \\n\\nAnd? \\n\\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\\n\\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\\n\\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\\n\\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\\nShe's Muslim\",\n \">\\n\\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult\",\n \">\\n\\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\\nYup totally an unpopular opinion\",\n \">\\n\\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate\",\n \">\\n\\nGot any proof of that\\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \\\"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\\\". \\nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion\",\n \">\\n\\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.\",\n \">\\n\\nwelp you lost then\",\n \">\\n\\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?\",\n \">\\n\\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅\",\n \">\\n\\nYou sound undercover prejudiced\",\n \">\\n\\nNot that deep undercover.\",\n \">\\n\\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.\",\n \">\\n\\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \\nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.\",\n \">\\n\\nMexican\",\n \">\\n\\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \\nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.\",\n \">\\n\\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.\",\n \">\\n\\n\\\"You believe what you know\\\"?\\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.\",\n \">\\n\\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them\",\n \">\\n\\nyea that’s basically my post\",\n \">\\n\\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\\n/S\",\n \">\\n\\nnever said that\",\n \">\\n\\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.\",\n \">\\n\\nI’m using culture and cult as different words\",\n \">\\n\\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.\",\n \">\\n\\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \\nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion\",\n \">\\n\\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?\",\n \">\\n\\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \\nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \\npersonal identity. Same logic follows\",\n \">\\n\\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \\\"it's a costume\\\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \\nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.\",\n \">\\n\\nhow?\",\n \">\\n\\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American\",\n \">\\n\\nwhite*\",\n \">\\n\\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.\",\n \">\\n\\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.\",\n \">\\n\\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.\",\n \">\\n\\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality\",\n \">\\n\\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?\",\n \">\\n\\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.\",\n \">\\n\\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.\",\n \">\\n\\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.\",\n \">\\n\\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \\\"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\\\" Or \\\"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\\\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.\",\n \">\\n\\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism\",\n \">\\n\\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol\",\n \">\\n\\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels\",\n \">\\n\\nthen explain\",\n \">\\n\\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.\",\n \">\\n\\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh\",\n \">\\n\\nfr\",\n \">\\n\\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture\",\n \">\\n\\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal\",\n \">\\n\\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity\",\n \">\\n\\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \\nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow\",\n \">\\n\\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \\nBut I do listen to music tho\",\n \">\\n\\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.\",\n \">\\n\\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?\",\n \">\\n\\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide\",\n \">\\n\\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?\",\n \">\\n\\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it\",\n \">\\n\\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.\",\n \">\\n\\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.\",\n \">\\n\\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value\",\n \">\\n\\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family\",\n \">\\n\\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \\\"other\\\" causes problems\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is exactly what op is doing\",\n \">\\n\\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more\",\n \">\\n\\nI'll agree with you until you get to \\\"black culture\\\".\\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \\\"black culture\\\" get a pass in this regards.\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.\",\n \">\\n\\n99% of the time white \\\"slaves\\\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \\\"nation\\\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.\",\n \">\\n\\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books\",\n \">\\n\\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?\",\n \">\\n\\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\\nbut it’s random asf.\\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult\",\n \">\\n\\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong\",\n \">\\n\\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \\nThey’d be too deep in the cult too\",\n \">\\n\\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for\",\n \">\\n\\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.\",\n \">\\n\\nYou can add religion to that.\",\n \">\\n\\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures\",\n \">\\n\\nI agree with you. It's cringe.\",\n \">\\n\\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?\",\n \">\\n\\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?\",\n \">\\n\\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring\",\n \">\\n\\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans\",\n \">\\n\\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \\\"black view or you want to be white so bad.\\\"\\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \\\"easy win\\\" in debates.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.\",\n \">\\n\\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead\",\n \">\\n\\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.\",\n \">\\n\\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.\",\n \">\\n\\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography\",\n \">\\n\\n\\\"Are the same people\\\" comments are always nonsense\",\n \">\\n\\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?\",\n \">\\n\\n\\\"Mexican, \\\"black\\\" and \\\"Asian\\\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.\",\n \">\\n\\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote\",\n \">\\n\\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.\",\n \">\\n\\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.\",\n \">\\n\\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \\nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \\n\\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \\n\\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \\nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol\",\n \">\\n\\nyou prolly would\",\n \">\\n\\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.\",\n \">\\n\\n\\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\\n\\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.\",\n \">\\n\\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above\",\n \">\\n\\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.\",\n \">\\n\\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.\",\n \">\\n\\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.\",\n \">\\n\\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.\",\n \">\\n\\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?\",\n \">\\n\\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?\",\n \">\\n\\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \\nCulture grounds us.\\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \\nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.\",\n \">\\n\\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today\",\n \">\\n\\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded\",\n \">\\n\\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.\",\n \">\\n\\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle\",\n \">\\n\\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.\",\n \">\\n\\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist\",\n \">\\n\\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \\nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.\",\n \">\\n\\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти\",\n \">\\n\\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.\",\n \">\\n\\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity\",\n \">\\n\\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?\",\n \">\\n\\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho\",\n \">\\n\\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.\",\n \">\\n\\nexactly\",\n \">\\n\\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \\nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.\",\n \">\\n\\n\\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\\n\\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.\",\n \">\\n\\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring\",\n \">\\n\\nFinally someone gets it\",\n \">\\n\\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from\",\n \">\\n\\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.\",\n \">\\n\\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back\",\n \">\\n\\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people\",\n \">\\n\\nThis.\",\n \">\\n\\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \\nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?\",\n \">\\n\\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?\",\n \">\\n\\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….\",\n \">\\n\\n\\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\\n\\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \\n\\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\\n\\nIdk why don't you ask them \\n\\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \\n\\nAnd? \\n\\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\\n\\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\\n\\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\\n\\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\\nShe's Muslim\",\n \">\\n\\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult\",\n \">\\n\\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\\nYup totally an unpopular opinion\",\n \">\\n\\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate\",\n \">\\n\\nGot any proof of that\\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \\\"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\\\". \\nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion\",\n \">\\n\\nIt brings a sense of community\",\n \">\\n\\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?\",\n \">\\n\\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \\nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \\nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.\",\n \">\\n\\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?\",\n \">\\n\\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅\",\n \">\\n\\nYou sound undercover prejudiced\",\n \">\\n\\nNot that deep undercover.\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \\\"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\\\" Or \\\"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\\\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.\",\n \">\\n\\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \\\"Irish\\\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.\",\n \">\\n\\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism\",\n \">\\n\\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol\",\n \">\\n\\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination\",\n \">\\n\\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.\",\n \">\\n\\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.\",\n \">\\n\\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \\nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.\",\n \">\\n\\nMexican\",\n \">\\n\\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \\nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.\",\n \">\\n\\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.\",\n \">\\n\\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them\",\n \">\\n\\nyea that’s basically my post\",\n \">\\n\\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...\",\n \">\\n\\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾\",\n \">\\n\\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \\\"it's a costume\\\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \\nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.\",\n \">\\n\\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.\",\n \">\\n\\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.\",\n \">\\n\\nhow?\",\n \">\\n\\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American\",\n \">\\n\\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \\\"others\\\".\",\n \">\\n\\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.\",\n \">\\n\\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality\",\n \">\\n\\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?\",\n \">\\n\\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.\",\n \">\\n\\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.\",\n \">\\n\\nyour point?\",\n \">\\n\\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.\",\n \">\\n\\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?\",\n \">\\n\\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \\nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \\npersonal identity. Same logic follows\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels\",\n \">\\n\\nthen explain\",\n \">\\n\\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.\",\n \">\\n\\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh\",\n \">\\n\\nPerson: •sneezes•\\nAmericans: that's racist\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?\",\n \">\\n\\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\\nbut it’s random asf.\\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult\",\n \">\\n\\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong\",\n \">\\n\\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \\nThey’d be too deep in the cult too\",\n \">\\n\\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture\",\n \">\\n\\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal\",\n \">\\n\\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity\",\n \">\\n\\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \\nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow\",\n \">\\n\\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \\nBut I do listen to music tho\",\n \">\\n\\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.\",\n \">\\n\\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value\",\n \">\\n\\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family\",\n \">\\n\\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \\\"other\\\" causes problems\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is exactly what op is doing\",\n \">\\n\\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more\",\n \">\\n\\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.\",\n \">\\n\\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?\",\n \">\\n\\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide\",\n \">\\n\\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?\",\n \">\\n\\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it\",\n \">\\n\\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.\",\n \">\\n\\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.\",\n \">\\n\\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.\",\n \">\\n\\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.\"\n]"}}},{"rowIdx":239699,"cells":{"comment":{"kind":"string","value":">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for"},"context":{"kind":"list like","value":["Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",">\n\nyour point?",">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",">\n\nexactly",">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",">\n\nThis.",">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",">\n\nwelp you lost then",">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",">\n\nMexican",">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",">\n\nnever said that",">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",">\n\nhow?",">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",">\n\nwhite*",">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",">\n\nthen explain",">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",">\n\nfr",">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",">\n\nyou prolly would",">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",">\n\nexactly",">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",">\n\nFinally someone gets it",">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",">\n\nThis.",">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",">\n\nMexican",">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...",">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",">\n\nhow?",">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".",">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",">\n\nyour point?",">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",">\n\nthen explain",">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist",">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",">\n\nwelp you lost then"],"string":"[\n \"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\\n\\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.\",\n \">\\n\\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above\",\n \">\\n\\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.\",\n \">\\n\\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \\nCulture grounds us.\\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \\nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.\",\n \">\\n\\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today\",\n \">\\n\\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.\",\n \">\\n\\nyour point?\",\n \">\\n\\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.\",\n \">\\n\\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.\",\n \">\\n\\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?\",\n \">\\n\\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?\",\n \">\\n\\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?\",\n \">\\n\\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….\",\n \">\\n\\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded\",\n \">\\n\\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.\",\n \">\\n\\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \\nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.\",\n \">\\n\\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.\",\n \">\\n\\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle\",\n \">\\n\\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.\",\n \">\\n\\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist\",\n \">\\n\\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.\",\n \">\\n\\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity\",\n \">\\n\\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?\",\n \">\\n\\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho\",\n \">\\n\\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.\",\n \">\\n\\nexactly\",\n \">\\n\\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people\",\n \">\\n\\nThis.\",\n \">\\n\\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \\nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.\",\n \">\\n\\n\\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\\n\\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.\",\n \">\\n\\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from\",\n \">\\n\\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.\",\n \">\\n\\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.\",\n \">\\n\\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back\",\n \">\\n\\nIt brings a sense of community\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?\",\n \">\\n\\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?\",\n \">\\n\\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \\nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \\nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.\",\n \">\\n\\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾\",\n \">\\n\\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \\nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?\",\n \">\\n\\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.\",\n \">\\n\\n\\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\\n\\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \\n\\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\\n\\nIdk why don't you ask them \\n\\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \\n\\nAnd? \\n\\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\\n\\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\\n\\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\\n\\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\\nShe's Muslim\",\n \">\\n\\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult\",\n \">\\n\\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\\nYup totally an unpopular opinion\",\n \">\\n\\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate\",\n \">\\n\\nGot any proof of that\\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \\\"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\\\". \\nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion\",\n \">\\n\\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.\",\n \">\\n\\nwelp you lost then\",\n \">\\n\\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?\",\n \">\\n\\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅\",\n \">\\n\\nYou sound undercover prejudiced\",\n \">\\n\\nNot that deep undercover.\",\n \">\\n\\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.\",\n \">\\n\\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \\nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.\",\n \">\\n\\nMexican\",\n \">\\n\\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \\nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.\",\n \">\\n\\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.\",\n \">\\n\\n\\\"You believe what you know\\\"?\\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.\",\n \">\\n\\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them\",\n \">\\n\\nyea that’s basically my post\",\n \">\\n\\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\\n/S\",\n \">\\n\\nnever said that\",\n \">\\n\\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.\",\n \">\\n\\nI’m using culture and cult as different words\",\n \">\\n\\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.\",\n \">\\n\\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \\nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion\",\n \">\\n\\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?\",\n \">\\n\\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \\nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \\npersonal identity. Same logic follows\",\n \">\\n\\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \\\"it's a costume\\\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \\nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.\",\n \">\\n\\nhow?\",\n \">\\n\\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American\",\n \">\\n\\nwhite*\",\n \">\\n\\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.\",\n \">\\n\\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.\",\n \">\\n\\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.\",\n \">\\n\\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality\",\n \">\\n\\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?\",\n \">\\n\\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.\",\n \">\\n\\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.\",\n \">\\n\\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.\",\n \">\\n\\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \\\"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\\\" Or \\\"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\\\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.\",\n \">\\n\\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism\",\n \">\\n\\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol\",\n \">\\n\\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels\",\n \">\\n\\nthen explain\",\n \">\\n\\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.\",\n \">\\n\\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh\",\n \">\\n\\nfr\",\n \">\\n\\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture\",\n \">\\n\\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal\",\n \">\\n\\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity\",\n \">\\n\\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \\nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow\",\n \">\\n\\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \\nBut I do listen to music tho\",\n \">\\n\\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.\",\n \">\\n\\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?\",\n \">\\n\\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide\",\n \">\\n\\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?\",\n \">\\n\\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it\",\n \">\\n\\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.\",\n \">\\n\\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.\",\n \">\\n\\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value\",\n \">\\n\\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family\",\n \">\\n\\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \\\"other\\\" causes problems\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is exactly what op is doing\",\n \">\\n\\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more\",\n \">\\n\\nI'll agree with you until you get to \\\"black culture\\\".\\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \\\"black culture\\\" get a pass in this regards.\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.\",\n \">\\n\\n99% of the time white \\\"slaves\\\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \\\"nation\\\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.\",\n \">\\n\\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books\",\n \">\\n\\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?\",\n \">\\n\\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\\nbut it’s random asf.\\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult\",\n \">\\n\\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong\",\n \">\\n\\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \\nThey’d be too deep in the cult too\",\n \">\\n\\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for\",\n \">\\n\\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.\",\n \">\\n\\nYou can add religion to that.\",\n \">\\n\\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures\",\n \">\\n\\nI agree with you. It's cringe.\",\n \">\\n\\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?\",\n \">\\n\\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?\",\n \">\\n\\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring\",\n \">\\n\\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans\",\n \">\\n\\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \\\"black view or you want to be white so bad.\\\"\\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \\\"easy win\\\" in debates.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.\",\n \">\\n\\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead\",\n \">\\n\\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.\",\n \">\\n\\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.\",\n \">\\n\\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography\",\n \">\\n\\n\\\"Are the same people\\\" comments are always nonsense\",\n \">\\n\\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?\",\n \">\\n\\n\\\"Mexican, \\\"black\\\" and \\\"Asian\\\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.\",\n \">\\n\\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote\",\n \">\\n\\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.\",\n \">\\n\\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.\",\n \">\\n\\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \\nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \\n\\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \\n\\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \\nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol\",\n \">\\n\\nyou prolly would\",\n \">\\n\\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.\",\n \">\\n\\n\\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\\n\\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.\",\n \">\\n\\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above\",\n \">\\n\\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.\",\n \">\\n\\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.\",\n \">\\n\\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.\",\n \">\\n\\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.\",\n \">\\n\\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?\",\n \">\\n\\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?\",\n \">\\n\\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \\nCulture grounds us.\\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \\nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.\",\n \">\\n\\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today\",\n \">\\n\\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded\",\n \">\\n\\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.\",\n \">\\n\\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle\",\n \">\\n\\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.\",\n \">\\n\\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist\",\n \">\\n\\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \\nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.\",\n \">\\n\\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти\",\n \">\\n\\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.\",\n \">\\n\\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity\",\n \">\\n\\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?\",\n \">\\n\\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho\",\n \">\\n\\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.\",\n \">\\n\\nexactly\",\n \">\\n\\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \\nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.\",\n \">\\n\\n\\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\\n\\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.\",\n \">\\n\\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring\",\n \">\\n\\nFinally someone gets it\",\n \">\\n\\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from\",\n \">\\n\\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.\",\n \">\\n\\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back\",\n \">\\n\\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people\",\n \">\\n\\nThis.\",\n \">\\n\\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \\nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?\",\n \">\\n\\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?\",\n \">\\n\\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….\",\n \">\\n\\n\\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\\n\\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \\n\\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\\n\\nIdk why don't you ask them \\n\\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \\n\\nAnd? \\n\\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\\n\\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\\n\\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\\n\\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\\nShe's Muslim\",\n \">\\n\\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult\",\n \">\\n\\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\\nYup totally an unpopular opinion\",\n \">\\n\\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate\",\n \">\\n\\nGot any proof of that\\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \\\"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\\\". \\nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion\",\n \">\\n\\nIt brings a sense of community\",\n \">\\n\\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?\",\n \">\\n\\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \\nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \\nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.\",\n \">\\n\\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?\",\n \">\\n\\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅\",\n \">\\n\\nYou sound undercover prejudiced\",\n \">\\n\\nNot that deep undercover.\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \\\"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\\\" Or \\\"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\\\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.\",\n \">\\n\\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \\\"Irish\\\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.\",\n \">\\n\\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism\",\n \">\\n\\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol\",\n \">\\n\\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination\",\n \">\\n\\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.\",\n \">\\n\\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.\",\n \">\\n\\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \\nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.\",\n \">\\n\\nMexican\",\n \">\\n\\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \\nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.\",\n \">\\n\\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.\",\n \">\\n\\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them\",\n \">\\n\\nyea that’s basically my post\",\n \">\\n\\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...\",\n \">\\n\\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾\",\n \">\\n\\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \\\"it's a costume\\\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \\nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.\",\n \">\\n\\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.\",\n \">\\n\\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.\",\n \">\\n\\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.\",\n \">\\n\\nhow?\",\n \">\\n\\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American\",\n \">\\n\\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \\\"others\\\".\",\n \">\\n\\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.\",\n \">\\n\\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality\",\n \">\\n\\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?\",\n \">\\n\\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.\",\n \">\\n\\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.\",\n \">\\n\\nyour point?\",\n \">\\n\\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.\",\n \">\\n\\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?\",\n \">\\n\\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \\nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \\npersonal identity. Same logic follows\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels\",\n \">\\n\\nthen explain\",\n \">\\n\\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.\",\n \">\\n\\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh\",\n \">\\n\\nPerson: •sneezes•\\nAmericans: that's racist\",\n \">\\n\\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?\",\n \">\\n\\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\\nbut it’s random asf.\\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult\",\n \">\\n\\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong\",\n \">\\n\\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \\nThey’d be too deep in the cult too\",\n \">\\n\\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture\",\n \">\\n\\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal\",\n \">\\n\\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity\",\n \">\\n\\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \\nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow\",\n \">\\n\\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \\nBut I do listen to music tho\",\n \">\\n\\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.\",\n \">\\n\\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value\",\n \">\\n\\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family\",\n \">\\n\\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \\\"other\\\" causes problems\",\n \">\\n\\nThis is exactly what op is doing\",\n \">\\n\\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more\",\n \">\\n\\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.\",\n \">\\n\\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?\",\n \">\\n\\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide\",\n \">\\n\\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?\",\n \">\\n\\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it\",\n \">\\n\\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.\",\n \">\\n\\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.\",\n \">\\n\\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.\",\n \">\\n\\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.\",\n \">\\n\\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.\",\n \">\\n\\nwelp you lost then\"\n]"}}}],"truncated":false,"partial":false},"paginationData":{"pageIndex":2396,"numItemsPerPage":100,"numTotalItems":246813,"offset":239600,"length":100}},"jwt":"eyJhbGciOiJFZERTQSJ9.eyJyZWFkIjp0cnVlLCJwZXJtaXNzaW9ucyI6eyJyZXBvLmNvbnRlbnQucmVhZCI6dHJ1ZX0sImlhdCI6MTc1NjY4NDI1Nywic3ViIjoiL2RhdGFzZXRzL2lubm92YXRpb24taGFja2luZzIvc2hpdHBvc3RpbmdfZGF0YXNldDEiLCJleHAiOjE3NTY2ODc4NTcsImlzcyI6Imh0dHBzOi8vaHVnZ2luZ2ZhY2UuY28ifQ.xNabtsolctCPr_WDdhEdJRGyj5YmbGclg90iNb7f1jCGeZoIeuLe1SNOOdE0I39guV5wCj4qsbADmYXvt2dBAw","displayUrls":true},"discussionsStats":{"closed":0,"open":0,"total":0},"fullWidth":true,"hasGatedAccess":true,"hasFullAccess":true,"isEmbedded":false,"savedQueries":{"community":[],"user":[]}}">
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Being the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon.
My cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.
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"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist"
] |
>
Якщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life."
] |
>
Couple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти"
] |
>
I escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason."
] |
>
but you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity"
] |
>
EVERYBODY strongly opposes cults
And I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?"
] |
>
maybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho"
] |
>
I think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture"
] |
>
exactly
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals."
] |
>
I mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.
And TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly"
] |
>
I mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.
Agree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.
Also agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware."
] |
>
So when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters
Your identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it."
] |
>
Finally someone gets it
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[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring"
] |
>
I was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it"
] |
>
I understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from"
] |
>
I wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me."
] |
>
being too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back"
] |
>
This.
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[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people"
] |
>
And how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?
Have you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?
What im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?
Have you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity?
There are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?
Also I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis."
] |
>
Yeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?"
] |
>
Why does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint."
] |
>
And maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?"
] |
>
Why do these people have to much pride in their culture?
Because they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with
Why do they overly identify with it?
Idk why don't you ask them
There’s so many cultures and different types of people out there.
And?
Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences
You have just described every adult on the planet
These are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.
If their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.
It's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion
My friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...
She's Muslim
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks…."
] |
>
your last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim"
] |
>
By that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...
Yup totally an unpopular opinion
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult"
] |
>
no I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion"
] |
>
Got any proof of that
And that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to "people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background".
And cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.
To be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate"
] |
>
It brings a sense of community
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[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion"
] |
>
Huh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community"
] |
>
I guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions.
Does OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?
Our entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this.
That being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?"
] |
>
I think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way."
] |
>
Ops or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?"
] |
>
You sound undercover prejudiced
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅"
] |
>
Not that deep undercover.
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced"
] |
>
I think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like "Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??" Or "You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.
I think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover."
] |
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Exactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us "Irish" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).
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[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex."
] |
>
This is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol)."
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People that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism
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[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in."
] |
>
exactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism"
] |
>
Yep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol"
] |
>
You said a lot without actually saying very much.
People identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.
People are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination"
] |
>
In some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring."
] |
>
Can I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?
I do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from.
I believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.
However being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females."
] |
>
Mexican
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult."
] |
>
I see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us.
You can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican"
] |
>
All cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind."
] |
>
Well literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact."
] |
>
yea that’s basically my post
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them"
] |
>
Honestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...
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[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post"
] |
>
It sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion..."
] |
>
TBH this is mainly just americans.
People, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as "it's a costume" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.)
But I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾"
] |
>
As someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors."
] |
>
Why don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian."
] |
>
It's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared."
] |
>
This opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS."
] |
>
how?
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[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho."
] |
>
You look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?"
] |
>
He's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as "others".
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American"
] |
>
Well I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\"."
] |
>
and you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.
Like if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?
These are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol."
] |
>
Which traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality"
] |
>
sounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?"
] |
>
Go on tribal land an express that opinion.
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no."
] |
>
your point?
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion."
] |
>
They have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?"
] |
>
How do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to."
] |
>
If they act to their stereotype in many different
ways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??
Their personality is simply their group identity.
And since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.
Cause losing your identity is worse than death
So if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their
personal identity. Same logic follows
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?"
] |
>
This is so intensely stupid on so many levels
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows"
] |
>
then explain
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels"
] |
>
You sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain"
] |
>
I guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away."
] |
>
Person: •sneezes•
Americans: that's racist
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh"
] |
>
I think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist"
] |
>
yes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.
but it’s random asf.
So same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?"
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It’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong
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[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult"
] |
>
your last sentence is exactly my point.
They’d be too deep in the cult too
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong"
] |
>
Translation: I really don’t have a culture
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too"
] |
>
More likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture"
] |
>
no it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal"
] |
>
Do you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving?
Do you have pop singers you like listening to?
Then yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity"
] |
>
no I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations
But I do listen to music tho
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow"
] |
>
As a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.
However, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho"
] |
>
This is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it."
] |
>
Everyone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline."
] |
>
No he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value"
] |
>
Yes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the "other" causes problems
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[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family"
] |
>
This is exactly what op is doing
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems"
] |
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OP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing"
] |
>
You're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more"
] |
>
You think nationalism only exists in America?
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on."
] |
>
No, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide
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[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?"
] |
>
Could you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide"
] |
>
She's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?"
] |
>
But it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it"
] |
>
Ethnicities and cultures are ever-changing.
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them."
] |
>
Right, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing."
] |
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You’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.
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[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change."
] |
>
This game of spot the white American was too easy.
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise."
] |
>
welp you lost then
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[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy."
] |
>
Because russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for
|
[
"Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S",
">\n\nnever said that",
">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.",
">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words",
">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.",
">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nwhite*",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nfr",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.",
">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.",
">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.",
">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books",
">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nYou can add religion to that.",
">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures",
">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.",
">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?",
">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans",
">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.",
">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.",
">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead",
">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.",
">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.",
">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography",
">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense",
">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?",
">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.",
">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?",
">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote",
">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.",
">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.",
">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol",
">\n\nyou prolly would",
">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.",
">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.",
">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above",
">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.",
">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.",
">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.",
">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.",
">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.",
">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.",
">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?",
">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?",
">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.",
">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today",
">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded",
">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.",
">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.",
">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle",
">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.",
">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist",
">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.",
">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти",
">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.",
">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity",
">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?",
">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho",
">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture",
">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.",
">\n\nexactly",
">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.",
">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.",
">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring",
">\n\nFinally someone gets it",
">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from",
">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.",
">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back",
">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people",
">\n\nThis.",
">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?",
">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.",
">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?",
">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….",
">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim",
">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult",
">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate",
">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion",
">\n\nIt brings a sense of community",
">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?",
">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.",
">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?",
">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅",
">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced",
">\n\nNot that deep undercover.",
">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.",
">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).",
">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.",
">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism",
">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol",
">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination",
">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.",
">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.",
">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.",
">\n\nMexican",
">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.",
">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.",
">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them",
">\n\nyea that’s basically my post",
">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...",
">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾",
">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.",
">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.",
">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.",
">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.",
">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.",
">\n\nhow?",
">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American",
">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".",
">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.",
">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality",
">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?",
">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.",
">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.",
">\n\nyour point?",
">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.",
">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?",
">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows",
">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels",
">\n\nthen explain",
">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.",
">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh",
">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist",
">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?",
">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult",
">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong",
">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too",
">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture",
">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal",
">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity",
">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow",
">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho",
">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.",
">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.",
">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value",
">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family",
">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems",
">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing",
">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more",
">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.",
">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?",
">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide",
">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?",
">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it",
">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.",
">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.",
">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.",
">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.",
">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.",
">\n\nwelp you lost then"
] |
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